Plus Channeling efficiency and value

[Millertime]

So far I've only played a solo game to learn the rules, and my questions are based on looking over the cards and trying to guess at the values. I don't have any real idea of match length or flow so I could be waaaay off here  B)

I was wondering what experienced players think of Channeling + objects and enchantments, and in particular their value. It looks like most of these cards have a 5-6x exchange rate, for example the Mana Crystal costs 5 mana and Moonglow Amulet costs 6, and each returns one mana per round. These spells in addition to taking up one of your readied spell slots and an action, will take 5-6 full rounds just to break even in mana.

Are these worth taking up space in your Spell Book?

Thanks!

[Sparkytbg]

I always used mana crystals or mana flowers in the beginning.  This way they are most effective, unless they are destroyed.  Most games usually are 8 to 15 turns long. The are some quick games that are under 8, but most aren't.  I usually dont use any mana builders after about turn 4.  

It is always good to have some versatility in your spell book.  If you are facing a wizard who is draining some of your mana.  Having ways to boost it is very helpful.  So I would say they are very helpful to have in your spell book.

[Klaxas]

the reason the amulet that adds channeling is slightly more expencive is because it is harder to destroy being a part of your mage it will likely stay the entire battle (unless fighting a wizard who is directly targeting your mana)

the channeling enchantment (harmonize) also costs 6 to put on your mage for the same reason.  but keep in mind you can add to your overall channeling (and a actions) by adding spawn points.  for example, if your a beastmaster, and you have a lair out, yes the lair generates the 2 mana, not you, but when it summons a creature using its mana it is still reducing the cost for you.  and casting harmonize on the lair is only 4 mana (cheaper than even a mana crystal)

so for example, the beastmaster can cast lair and harmonzise on turn 1.  that gives the lair channeling 3 so you can cast 1 bitterwood fox per turn for 2 mana.  and if you find one turn you need that extra mana, dont cast with the spawn point and the following turn you will have 6 mana available to cast something.

the same principle applies to all spawnpoints.

[Shad0w]

Your assumption is correct (remember that you should each nonage object channeling separately they dont and to your channeling but you can pay the difference.)outside of a Amulet i almost never use harmonize or spawn-points unless my strategy requires it (equip heavy book with battle forge for example). The thing I try to do is look at a strategy and find the best way to make it happen. the biggest thing is not wasting your action on summoning.

[Klaxas]

i almost always try to use a spawn point.  not only for the extra mana, but for the extra action.

[Nikoli Ranvier]

The spawn points are always great for extra actions and mana devoted to a strategy, but the original question of mana crystals or flowers for me is always a yes. They are cheap in spell book building and offer VARIETY to counter an opponents game. When playing you may or may not use them, but at only a point or two from the building process you should consider placing one to two there. Also I find them useful in zone control from opponents while still benefitting yourself in the channeling phase. Of course everyone will play differently, but it is always good to incorporate a counter to everything when playing a new opponent. Have fun!

[Klaxas]

true i do not believe i have ever made a book without mana crystals or mana flowers.  it is never bad to have extra channeling.  even if you dont plan on using them if you play against a wizard built for mana denial, you will be glad you threw a couple in your book.  the wizard with agressive mana denial can cast a supression orb on you on turn 1 and there is very little you can do about it.  (if you know he is going to do it you can throw a wall up and hide behind it, but usually its too late)

[Shad0w]

The trick is to see how well you can do with only minimal channeling items verse mana denial. When playtesting you should look at worst and best case senior.

[Dapuma]

Ok, I have to know how to do this, I just got the game and am looking to make a Wizard mana denial deck, I am thinking creature heavy but I have not played so could be way off base as to what is effective...that being said, how am i going to get off Supression orb on turn one...because that sounds awesome

true i do not believe i have ever made a book without mana crystals or mana flowers.  it is never bad to have extra channeling.  even if you dont plan on using them if you play against a wizard built for mana denial, you will be glad you threw a couple in your book.  the wizard with agressive mana denial can cast a supression orb on you on turn 1 and there is very little you can do about it.  (if you know he is going to do it you can throw a wall up and hide behind it, but usually its too late)

[Dapuma]

I was thinking of that being a different card

i dont see how that would be that effective since it doesnt bind to the mage

i was thinking that was a mana upkeep for the mage for some reason...what would the purpose of dropping that on turn one be...i can see if you will fight a swarm so it slows down a swarm coming after you...walls and that outside where your mage is so the swarm has to come through it...please let me know how that card becomes so effective...it is epic so it has to be good

[Klaxas]

im sorry it was late and i meant the mana siphon.  the one that reduces the opponents channeling by 2.  and here is how to drop it on turn 1.  pass your quick cast phase, on your main action phase move 2 spots, into the middle of the board, drop the mana siphon one space away from you which should be within 2 spaces of his mage.

he can place walls up to stop you if he places them in the exact right spot.  remember mana siphon has to be placed within 2 spots of the enemy mage.

after you drop it make sure to play down tanglevines and such.  anything you can do to prevent him from killing the siphon.  place walls around it to protect it.  then decide how you want to finish it, big creatures or spells.

[fas723]

Question:
Isn't Mana cristal and Mana Flower global, and effect both your mage and all your spawn points?

[Dapuma]

ahh ok yes that is what i was thinking of mana siphon and that is a great opening move, and makes the opponent change their strategy completly, while slowing them down

I like it

I am assuming that works better if you are going 2nd round 1 because they will have already used one of their actions

p1:  takes action
p2: takes action (move to middle)
p1 quick action:  takes quick action
p2:  takes quick action (mana siphon)

Is that roughly how it would go?

[Mestrahd]

Question:
Isn't Mana cristal and Mana Flower global, and effect both your mage and all your spawn points?

Yes they are global, in the sense that you don't have to stay within any range of them to reap the benefit. But I believe the text specifically says it grants your MAGE Channeling +1, so they wouldn't effect your spawnpoints.

[fas723]

Question:
Isn't Mana cristal and Mana Flower global, and effect both your mage and all your spawn points?

Yes they are global, in the sense that you don't have to stay within any range of them to reap the benefit. But I believe the text specifically says it grants your MAGE Channeling +1, so they wouldn't effect your spawnpoints.

I read it yesterday just to be sure. It says: Controler get +1 channeling.
I think it would make sens if they were global for real, and boost you spawn points too (even if the rules might not say so). This would also make then slightly better and the issue with flat channeling curve would go away some.

Can we get an official statment on this?