Mysterys "Vines Everywhere"

[Biblofilter]

[spellbook]
[spellbookheader]
[spellbookname]vines everywhere[/spellbookname]
[mage]A Druid Spellbook[/mage]
[mage]built by the OCTGN SBB[/mage]
[/spellbookheader]
[spells]
[spellclass]Conjuration[/spellclass]
[mwcard=DNJ03]1 x Etherian Lifetree[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNJ11]2 x Tanglevine[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNJ12]1 x Vine Tree[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNJ10]4 x Stranglevine[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1J13]1 x Mana Flower[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKJ01]1 x Enchanter's Wardstone[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1J18]1 x Poison Gas Cloud[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1J19]1 x Deathlock[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Creature[/spellclass]
[mwcard=DNC10]1 x Raptor Vine[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1C34]1 x Steelclaw Grizzly[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNC20]1 x Vine Snapper[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1C13]1 x Fellella, Pixie Familiar[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Enchantment[/spellclass]
[mwcard=MW1E03]1 x Bull Endurance[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E36]2 x Rhino Hide[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNE01]1 x Barkskin[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWE04]1 x Force Crush[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKE04]4 x Enchantment Transfusion[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWBD1E01]1 x Astral Anchor[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E09]2 x Agony[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E19]2 x Ghoul Rot[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E31]2 x Poisoned Blood[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E29]3 x Nullify[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX2FFE04]2 x Brace Yourself[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E32]1 x Regrowth[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E10]2 x Decoy[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E24]2 x Magebane[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX2FFE07]1 x Rust[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Equipment[/spellclass]
[mwcard=MW1Q09]1 x Enchanter's Ring[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q16]1 x Leather Gloves[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q19]1 x Mage Wand[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q15]1 x Leather Boots[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q07]1 x Elemental Cloak[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q02]2 x Bearskin[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Incantation[/spellclass]
[mwcard=FWI13]1 x Seeking Dispel[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1I28]1 x Teleport[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNI02]3 x Burst of Thorns[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWI16]3 x Dissolve[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWI11]3 x Dispel[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Attack[/spellclass]
[mwcard=MW1A08]1 x Geyser[/mwcard]
[/spells]
[cost]Total cost: 120 pts[/cost]
[/spellbook]

WHY?

Watermage DoT

Acid Ball
Dissolve
Crumble
Corrosive Orchid

Cheap in school and Corrosive Orchid can be cast from the tree.

So why run a DoT strategy as a Druid?

[Mystery]

cause you have fellela for enchantments and you have the tree for the stranglevines

your tree also gives you some surviveabilty

[Puddnhead]

Probably because:

1) No one is expecting it
2) Enchatments are very easy to cast using Fellella
3) Enchantments in general are very powerful and are an active strategy instead of a passive "undo" strategy.
4) Enchantment Transfusion gets around Nullify with one action both offensively and defensively and is better than a probe + Dissolve

Fellella with Enchantment Transfusion and Vine Tree with a Wand of Burst of Thorns means that you never have to worry about anything your opponent is actually doing to buff/defend himself.  You get around Armor and Nullify with no real fear of running out of answers.

Honestly, I hate Enchantment Transfusion and the "DoTs in every book" mentality, but Mystery has proved time and again that it works and works well.

Due to Enchantment Transfusion, Enchantments are the only spell type that can protect themselves.  This has partially changed with the introduction of Champion's Gauntlets, but they are no where near as powerful as an instant-anytime-transfuse of whatever protection spell you need.

[Biblofilter]

"Im putting Seeking Dispel in every book" Keejchen's bitter comment, after meeting "Poison in the Jungle" and "Vines Everywhere" Sunday

This spellbook is a beast and its pretty fast as well. It might just be the best book ever

Enchantment Transfusion might be OP, but im pretty happy that their is answer to high armor builds.

Force Crush is something im going to cut. Its 6 spellpoint, so i could get +1 Enchantment Transfusion, +1 Agony and +2 Tanglerroot for that. 6 spellbook points are a lot, but the main reason im removing it, is to avoid making the mistake of casting it early (again) or midgame (again).

Both times it nearly cost me the game.

Casting it late on the other hand, that wins games.

[Puddnhead]

"Im putting Seeking Dispel in every book" Keejchen's bitter comment, after meeting "Poison in the Jungle" and "Vines Everywhere" Sunday

This spellbook is a beast and its pretty fast as well. It might just be the best book ever

Enchantment Transfusion might be OP, but im pretty happy that their is answer to high armor builds.

Force Crush is something im going to cut. Its 6 spellpoint, so i could get +1 Enchantment Transfusion, +1 Agony and +2 Tanglerroot for that. 6 spellbook points are a lot, but the main reason im removing it, is to avoid making the mistake of casting it early (again) or midgame (again).

Both times it nearly cost me the game.

Casting it late on the other hand, that wins games.

Force Crush does win games.  That's one idea behind the Fatigue Forcemaster.  You run them out of dispels and then force crush for the win.

[Reddicediaries]

"Im putting Seeking Dispel in every book" Keejchen's bitter comment, after meeting "Poison in the Jungle" and "Vines Everywhere" Sunday

This spellbook is a beast and its pretty fast as well. It might just be the best book ever

Enchantment Transfusion might be OP, but im pretty happy that their is answer to high armor builds.

Force Crush is something im going to cut. Its 6 spellpoint, so i could get +1 Enchantment Transfusion, +1 Agony and +2 Tanglerroot for that. 6 spellbook points are a lot, but the main reason im removing it, is to avoid making the mistake of casting it early (again) or midgame (again).

Both times it nearly cost me the game.

Casting it late on the other hand, that wins games.

Force Crush does win games.  That's one idea behind the Fatigue Forcemaster.  You run them out of dispels and then force crush for the win.

Even with the original using only one force crush

[Halewijn]

I also HATE enchantment transfusion. DOT builds are already crazy hard to counter, with ET it becomes nearly impossible. If your deck is not super aggressive and you don't have a ton of arcane stuff to stop it, you have almost no chance to win.  (Let's not forget Enchanters wardstone)

I would love seeing errata on ET. Maybe only allowing it to be revealed when a creature dies. (Like the art suggests) Or at the least some errata that it cannot be used to protect enchantments.

[Mystery]

"Im putting Seeking Dispel in every book" Keejchen's bitter comment, after meeting "Poison in the Jungle" and "Vines Everywhere" Sunday

This spellbook is a beast and its pretty fast as well. It might just be the best book ever

Enchantment Transfusion might be OP, but im pretty happy that their is answer to high armor builds.

I also HATE enchantment transfusion. DOT builds are already crazy hard to counter, with ET it becomes nearly impossible. If your deck is not super aggressive and you don't have a ton of arcane stuff to stop it, you have almost no chance to win.  (Let's not forget Enchanters wardstone)

I would love seeing errata on ET. Maybe only allowing it to be revealed when a creature dies. (Like the art suggests) Or at the least some errata that it cannot be used to protect enchantments.

what do you want? what is OP? How can it be OP if it is the possibility to beat the so called high armor is OP. how is overpowered defined?

it hardly pays of mana wise, action wise only on 2+,
and guys if you cast purify to get rid of your poison curses it costs no mana if ET triggers and all you spend no mana. Same with remove curse, so just run a bit of this. Those books mainly work cause you are not prepared for.

[bigfatchef]

"Im putting Seeking Dispel in every book" Keejchen's bitter comment, after meeting "Poison in the Jungle" and "Vines Everywhere" Sunday

This spellbook is a beast and its pretty fast as well. It might just be the best book ever

Enchantment Transfusion might be OP, but im pretty happy that their is answer to high armor builds.

I also HATE enchantment transfusion. DOT builds are already crazy hard to counter, with ET it becomes nearly impossible. If your deck is not super aggressive and you don't have a ton of arcane stuff to stop it, you have almost no chance to win.  (Let's not forget Enchanters wardstone)

I would love seeing errata on ET. Maybe only allowing it to be revealed when a creature dies. (Like the art suggests) Or at the least some errata that it cannot be used to protect enchantments.

what do you want? what is OP? How can it be OP if it is the possibility to beat the so called high armor is OP. how is overpowered defined?

it hardly pays of mana wise, action wise only on 2+,
and guys if you cast purify to get rid of your poison curses it costs no mana if ET triggers and all you spend no mana. Same with remove curse, so just run a bit of this. Those books mainly work cause you are not prepared for.

Yeah Mystery is totally right here. ET is a very strong card, but needs proper play and can also be countered by good play. I don't like to play against DOT builds, but they are good against high armor tanks, wich are also no fun to play against (thinking about it there are even more strategies that are not fun to play against... but then in the end it IS fun to try hard and counter those tough books)
So the remaining question is: is DOT the end of the ladder? Best strategy to win? Or will time and research and new cards bring something even stronger?

The nicest would be if the circle gets closed like Rock–paper–scissors

[Halewijn]

Not saying it is OP, but battling a DOT build does, for me, not feel like a mage wars game but more like a mixture between chess and poker. A mixture of calculations/benefit analysis, and reading your opponent like hell. For that reason alone, I think DOT builds are harder on OCTGN than in real life.

You have to be sure to read your opponent very carefully and make no mistakes. Get rid of the crucial enchantments, leave the non-vital ones. Make very good mana calculations what will be advantage for you to get rid of, ...

Yeah Mystery is totally right here. ET is a very strong card, but needs proper play and can also be countered by good play. I don't like to play against DOT builds, but they are good against high armor tanks, wich are also no fun to play against (thinking about it there are even more strategies that are not fun to play against... but then in the end it IS fun to try hard and counter those tough books)
So the remaining question is: is DOT the end of the ladder? Best strategy to win? Or will time and research and new cards bring something even stronger?

The nicest would be if the circle gets closed like Rock–paper–scissors

True, Armor builds are also not fun to battle.  (I like enchanters wardstone btw)

I guess I am simply a fan of the more straightforward mage battles 

[Kelanen]

does not feel like a mage wars game but more like a mixture between chess and poker. A mixture of calculations/benefit analysis, and reading your opponent like hell.

Interesting - to me that is precisely and solely what MW is...

I guess I am simply a fan of the more straightforward mage battles 

Ah, the ones I never play.

I don't know if you play other CCG's or wargames? To use MtG as the most universal example - I play discard, permission, land destruction, lock, stasis... I never go for 'play some creatures and run them at the opponent, which I guess would be your style. Johnny/spike vs Timmy in Magic speak...

Back on topic, ET needs planning and skillful play. Given that Enchantments are the only reactions in this game, I'd like to see a lot more effects like this, not less!

[Mystery]

Not saying it is OP, but battling a DOT build does, for me, not feel like a mage wars game but more like a mixture between chess and poker. A mixture of calculations/benefit analysis, and reading your opponent like hell. For that reason alone, I think DOT builds are harder on OCTGN than in real life.

You have to be sure to read your opponent very carefully and make no mistakes. Get rid of the crucial enchantments, leave the non-vital ones. Make very good mana calculations what will be advantage for you to get rid of, ...

That is exactly what mage wars for me is a lot about reading and good decissions and not about summoning creatures and throwing attack spells and hoping for the fortune of the dice (i hate chess and poker by the way)

[Halewijn]

That is exactly what mage wars for me is a lot about reading and good decissions and not about summoning creatures and throwing attack spells and hoping for the fortune of the dice (i hate chess and poker by the way)

I like those parts in a general MW game too. But with battling DOT-builds, it feels like it's only that and then it becomes an overkill for me. But yes, I like rolling (huge amounts) of dice and playing creatures.

Eg: My Makunda build I posted very recently. Straightforward, light, fun. But this does not mean you can "just play something". I still have to carefully choose between bobcats/leopards/temple of the dawnbreaker/Tooth and claw/something else.

I don't know if you play other CCG's or wargames? To use MtG as the most universal example - I play discard, permission, land destruction, lock, stasis... I never go for 'play some creatures and run them at the opponent, which I guess would be your style. Johnny/spike vs Timmy in Magic speak...

I read the Johnny/Spike/Timmy thing and I can relate with all three of them to be honest.

I love playing huge impressive cards, I enjoy playing unpopular cards but I am still very competitive and want to win.

[Coshade]

Honestly I think DOT builds and creature heavy builds are all pretty fun to play. I'm not sure I would be willing to say one is necessarily deeper down the think train. Both require a lot of spellbook work and planning during a game.
I will say about Enchantment Transfusion though, is that it does seem to get away with a lot that it probably shouldn't be allowed to.

[keejchen]

I will say about Enchantment Transfusion though, is that it does seem to get away with a lot that it probably shouldn't be allowed to.

Well put Coshade, I think you might be right

For the record, even though biblo has bullied me with ET several times now, I do not consider ET to be "op". Most of the time it's still fun to see it played well, despite it being frustrating when your book can't deal with it.
There is no denying that this spell has changed the game and how we have to look at enchantments now. For better or worse is hard to tell.