Ichthellids and demons

[Kharhaz]

Couldn't it be possible to use the clerics even more efficient  if you also let them pray by an altar (let's say altar of skulls) each turn before the combo?

Just an idea:

[mwcard=MW1J17]Pentagram[/mwcard] w/ Harmonize

Would be a more efficient way to get the Ace into the arena. Requires Warlock instead of Necro

[ACG]

But then where do you get the mana for the Ghoul?

Ghoul is 13 mana. Pentagram + Harmonize is 18. Ichthellid is 9. You need 40 mana, 2 full actions, and 2 quick actions to cast all of these, before you can start summoning clerics. I can't see a way to do it, especially with the Warlock's lower channeling.

You would have the 40 mana by turn 4, it is true. But that means you can't really be summoning clerics until Turn 5.

Turn 1: 19 mana
Turn 2: 28 mana
Turn 3: 37 mana
Turn 4: 46 mana

The delay could be fatal, since this takes time to set up anyways.

[ACG]

But then where do you get the mana for the Ghoul?

Ghoul is 13 mana. Pentagram + Harmonize is 18. Ichthellid is 9. You need 40 mana, 2 full actions, and 2 quick actions to cast all of these, before you can start summoning clerics. I can't see a way to do it, especially with the Warlock's lower channeling.

You would have the 40 mana by turn 4, it is true. But that means you can't really be summoning clerics until Turn 5.

Turn 1: 19 mana
Turn 2: 28 mana
Turn 3: 37 mana
Turn 4: 46 mana

The delay could be fatal, since this takes time to set up anyways.

Okay, the pentagram can cast the clerics with its own mana supply round 3-4. But you still can't start impregnating the clerics until round 5, since that is the earliest you can act with both undead creatures.

[fas723]

Couldn't it be possible to use the clerics even more efficient  if you also let them pray by an altar (let's say altar of skulls) each turn before the combo?

That would require delaying the combo. The clerics can't pray on the same turn they are brought into play, but they can be impregnated, sacrificed, and eaten on that turn.

Sure, but it will only be 1 turn delay in total. And you will have 4 counters on the altar.

Another idea could be raise dead on your sacrificed creatures to gain some crowd control. The new Imp is especially good with this since it can teleport and neutralize the zombie effect a bit.

[ACG]

Another idea could be raise dead on your sacrificed creatures to gain some crowd control. The new Imp is especially good with this since it can teleport and neutralize the zombie effect a bit.

If you do this, you can't buff the ghoul, since its ability obliterates the creatures it consumes.

[Boocheck]

I must definetly missing something. [mwcard=DNC05]Ichthellid[/mwcard] 1 mana for transfer and thats it. If you want another egg token, you need another ichthellid...

[ACG]

I must definetly missing something. [mwcard=DNC05]Ichthellid[/mwcard] 1 mana for transfer and thats it. If you want another egg token, you need another ichthellid...

Each new Ichthellid comes with a new egg. Each cycle of this combo creates the egg that you need for the next cycle.

[rodriguekhalil]

Couldn't it be possible to use the clerics even more efficient  if you also let them pray by an altar (let's say altar of skulls) each turn before the combo?

That would require delaying the combo. The clerics can't pray on the same turn they are brought into play, but they can be impregnated, sacrificed, and eaten on that turn.

Sure, but it will only be 1 turn delay in total. And you will have 4 counters on the altar.

I've thought about making more profit out of the clerics sacrifice with either an [mwcard=DNJ01]Altar of Skulls[/mwcard] or a [mwcard=DNJ04]Graveyard[/mwcard]. Granted, I would gain a lot of mana/skull tokens during these first rounds, but I can't find a way to do it without delaying the cycle at least one turn.

I also considered attacking with the Ichthehllids early during the game to make profit of the Melee +1 and Piercing +1 bonus given by the Aco's sacrifice. I guess that can be done, but it will depend on the creatures and the mage I'm facing.  I wouldn't want to lose too many of my creatures before the Ghoul is ready to battle.

I'm building right now a spell book around this strategy, should be able to post it soon. We'll what it looks like.

EDIT: I just realized that Altar of skulls works only when enemy creatures are destroyed, doesn't work as well.

[Kharhaz]

Couldn't it be possible to use the clerics even more efficient  if you also let them pray by an altar (let's say altar of skulls) each turn before the combo?

That would require delaying the combo. The clerics can't pray on the same turn they are brought into play, but they can be impregnated, sacrificed, and eaten on that turn.

Sure, but it will only be 1 turn delay in total. And you will have 4 counters on the altar.

I've thought about making more profit out of the clerics sacrifice with either an [mwcard=DNJ01]Altar of Skulls[/mwcard] or a [mwcard=DNJ04]Graveyard[/mwcard]. Granted, I would gain a lot of mana/skull tokens during these first rounds, but I can't find a way to do it without delaying the cycle at least one turn.

I also considered attacking with the Ichthehllids early during the game to make profit of the Melee +1 and Piercing +1 bonus given by the Aco's sacrifice. I guess that can be done, but it will depend on the creatures and the mage I'm facing.  I wouldn't want to lose too many of my creatures before the Ghoul is ready to battle.

I'm building right now a spell book around this strategy, should be able to post it soon. We'll what it looks like.

[mwcard=DNC01]Acolyte of the Bog Queen[/mwcard] cannot be summoned from a graveyard so which is why I was thinking that pentagram might work better.

Once pentagram and altar are up and running that machine takes care of itself.

[fas723]

EDIT: I just realized that Altar of skulls works only when enemy creatures are destroyed, doesn't work as well.

You can still pray.


It would be nice to see this combo in action by Arcane Duels! (hint hint...)

[Intangible0]

It would be nice to see this combo in action by Arcane Duels! (hint hint...)

You can count on it! I've been brewing this spell book for awhile so it would be a shame not to have it in an episode.

For everyone talking about praying to alters and other tactics, I would love it if you tried that build out! I'm worried that this tactic is too slow as is, but if you're successful with such plays then it means that my fear is invalid. It'd be great if I could be proven wrong here

[rodriguekhalil]

   Looking forward to it!

[DaveW]

I tried this strategy against a Warlock (original one) who was buffed with multiple enchantments. The Warlock had Aegis 1, four armor and a Vet belt. The multiple Ichthelids were no match for it once the Ghoul was gone.

However, I have to admit that I played the Ghoul wrong. I left it to defend my Necromancer (in a zone with Fortified Position). Instead, I should have been much more offensive with it while summoning my other undead creatures. That would have helped to keep the Warlock away from my Necro during this time.

So, my thinking is to build up the Ghoul, have it go on the offensive alone while summoning many other creatures, and then have the mass engage the enemy.

I still haven't played anything but a solo Mage though, so I'm thinking that this may have been one of the toughest match-ups to face.

[rodriguekhalil]

Okay, so here it is.  The following book is inspired from this thread. Probably not as good as Intangible's, but I tried!

As was stated in the beginning of this thread, the following book goes like this:

T1 (20) : Ravenous Ghoul + Mana Crystal
T2 (13) : Ichthellid + Enchantment on myself
T3 (13) : Acolyte + Sacrificial Altar. Ichthellid attacks Aco, Sacrifice Aco, Ravenous eats the remains.
T4 to T7: repeat cycle if possible.

I continue repeating as much as the opponent allows me to.

Then, depending on how the opponent is playing, I either continue to cast enchantments and summon creatures or I equip myself and go help Ravenous Ghoul.   In that case, Buff myself with Bear Strength/Rhino Hide/Cheetah speed and eventually tranfuse them to Malacoda or vice versa.

Another aspect of this book is poison damage I can make. If I can pull it off (that's a big if), I trap my opponent in a poison gas cloud + Malacoda zone while having Idol of Pestilence out and hit him with all I have.

The 2 Drain Soul will help either finish the opponent or put a poison condition on him to use my ability. Of course, I use Deathlock only if the opponent and his creatures are regenerating too much. I intend to use Poisoned blood first.

That's it! Let me know if you have any comments or if you try the book.



[spellbook]
[spellbookheader]
[spellbookname]Buddy Ichthellid Necromancer[/spellbookname]
[mage]Necromancer[/mage]
[/spellbookheader]
[spells]
[spellclass]Attack[/spellclass]
[mwcard=DNA01]2 x  Acid Ball[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Conjuration[/spellclass]
[mwcard=FWJ02]1 x Archer's Watchtower[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1j19]1 x  Deathlock[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1j11]1 x  Idol of Pestilence[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1j12]1 x  Mana Crystal[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1J18]1 x Poison Gas Cloud[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1J20]1 x Sacrificial Altar[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1j22]2 x  Tanglevine[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNW02]2 x  Wall of Bones[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Creature[/spellclass]
[mwcard=DNC01]4 x Acolyte of the Bog Queen[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNC05]4 x Ichthellid[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1C23]1 x Malacoda[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNC11]1 x Ravenous Ghoul[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNC13]2 x  Skeletal Archer[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Enchantment[/spellclass]
[mwcard=MWSTX2FFE02]1 x Akiro's Favor[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E01]1 x Bear Strength[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E05]1 x Cheetah Speed[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKE04]2 x Enchantment Transfusion[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e14]1 x  Enfeeble[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E19]2 x Ghoul Rot[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E27]1 x Marked for Death[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E29]3 x Nullify[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E31]2 x Poisoned Blood[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1E36]1 x Rhino Hide[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Equipment[/spellclass]
[mwcard=DNQ01]1 x  Cloak of Shadows[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNQ03]1 x  Deathshroud Staff[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q05]1 x Demonhide Armor[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKQ06]1 x  Eagleclaw Boots[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q07]1 x Elemental Cloak[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q11]1 x Gauntlets of Strength[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1Q18]1 x Mage Staff[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNQ07]1 x Veteran's Belt[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Incantation[/spellclass]
[mwcard=MWSTX2FFI03]2 x Disarm[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i06]2 x  Dispel[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i07]1 x  Dissolve[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKI01]2 x  Drain Soul[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MW1I12]2 x Force Push[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i24]1 x  Seeking Dispel[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i28]1 x  Teleport[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNI03]1 x  Reassemble[/mwcard]
[/spells]
[cost]Total cost: 120 pts[/cost]
[/spellbook]