What the holy hand grenade of antioch is going on with the necromancer?

[phillipsjr2]

Not to be too sensationalist, but he is powerful. In his base spellbook with no modifications he tore my finely tuned beastmaster to shreds. Suffice it to say having the facebook equipped, plus a graveyard, using the meditation crystal to generate mana while using your spawn points to generate creatures, feeding zombies to the ever-growing zombie who gets to 10 attack + bloodthirsty 1 immune to non critical attacks 24 health... I know it's 6 turns to set up, but while you hang back and turn him into an unbeatable machine for almost no resources (1 mana a turn to summon a 4 point zombie after the engine is set up)... you also build up the rest of your unfathomably powerful army.

In my opinion the sheer power resides in one rule: resilience. Every zombie in that book has effectively an armor stat of infinite, and are NOT overpriced by any stretch of the imagination for what they do. I'd love to be argued against here: it was a little disheartening to so rend my opponent to shreds with this mage!

[DarthDadaD20]

First I am going to saw that the necros base spell book is one of the most strait forward book to run- its (And this is a technical term) RARW ZOMBIES!!!

But seriously, I have noticed that the base necro book is a good one, and its hard to go wrong when playing it.

For the overall necro- Yes, he is powerful- but in my many, many matchups with him, I have found many tricks that shut him down.

First off- he is stretched thin for mana- those hoards dont cast themselves! Since the necro spends most of his mana (And actions) summoning and getting out his spawnpoints; in the early game, he is offten left unequiped, and even twords the late game, he is usually very unenchanted when compared to most mages. And this is not a side effect of play style, its something that comes from swarming with the necros medium costed creatures. (You can supper equip/enchant the necro just fine- but his swarms will suffer)

Another thing is that the necro can really easly be "The odd man out" or targeted easily. Its not hard to separate him from his creatures. And I would say that the best chance that a forcemaster would have it to push everything else away, and keep the necro held with something like force crush.

Cast tangle vine, teleport, force crush, ANYTHING to keep the necro away from his creatures. A necro with Alter of the Iron Guard and zombies poping up all around him is a VERY tough opponent indeed.

Another way that he is easily targeted is by a Wizard. IMO the wizard is the perfect Necro counter. He can just blast spells from afar and keep pressure on the necro- causing the necro to change his plans and really mess with his strategy. Wizards tower can even flank him, causing his zombies to slowly shamble in different directions, which makes them much easer to pick off.

And with the beastmaster- He can enchant his creatures; the necro cant. Buff a bear with Bear Strenth and lions savagery, eagle wings and maybe a defence and have it hover over the necro for the game, and even with skeletal archers and attack spells- you should have one dead necro on your hands.

TL;DR- the necros creatures are slow (Lumbering!) if they are resilient and he can be easily "Sniped" by mages with attck spells.

The necro focuses so much time and mana of getting those swarms; he often leaves himself unequipped and unenchanted.

The necro cannot enchant his undead creatures.

Really its hard to confront the necro head on- but with some range, and lots of tricks, he should be defeated with a little effort.

[phillipsjr2]

I like your feedback! The only thing I'll comment on immediately is that I didn't find the lumbering rule limiting enough. I've played a lot of Mage wars and I can count on two hands the number of times I've actually needed to double move a creature. This being the only restriction on lumbering is a minor one! I guess too in my group of casual players we always have a normal start up to our games- both players will spend a few turns building up their little army before they move in to engage. The necromancer seemed to be outpacing their foe here pretty hard. Between ring of undeath, graveyard, facebook, and the meditation amulet, that's 6-7 free bonus mana a turn at a cost of 30(ish)- doesn't take long for him to recoup this and go majorly into the action economy super mana zone!

[DarthDadaD20]

And your right- I have said many times (And its even been said Im worng...) but I think the meditation amulet was just a perfect fit for the necro- he doesn't need to use his full action with his spawn points, and yeah, I have seen his mana go off the board.

I think that with a little economy set up, and then just go directly for that necro is the best action.

I would say that the necro is in this special (As of now) niche, where he is VERY strong against certain mages and play styles and very weak against others. (Which every mage has a sort of "Counter mage")

Try a game with a wizard using a little mana economy set up with lots of attack spells and see how that works for you in fighting the necro. I have a 12 win streak of beating the necro with a wizard (This was in playtesting) but with little set up and constant attack spells, the necro should go down.

[Terrazas]

How does the necro fare in a 2v2?

Me and my play group are trying it tomorrow for the first time, any advice?

[Sailor Vulcan]

I think teammates should cover each other's weaknesses. A Druid build with Fellela and battle forge would be good for enchanting your creatures, and giving you equipment. Plus, the vine markers will hinder enemy creatures, which is the same thing that lumbering does to your zombies.

Send your eternal savant to guard the Druid while she sets up all her vine markers. Once all the zones have vine markers in them, use Force Wave on your Horde, then zombie frenzy!

If your opponents are also swarming, you'll want to teleport an enemy mage to your side of the board, then your Druid teammate should cast tangle/stranglevine on that enemy mage

If the Druid is using Bloodspine walls, make sure that she only walls in herself and your savant and not you.

Alternatively, the Druid can set up Bloodspine walls and thornlashers down the middle of the arena, then snatch the enemy mages into your swarm. This strategy would probably be better with some skeleton archers and knights to protect the middle line of the arena.

Of course since I haven't gotten to play much multiplayer yet, this likely is only a little more than educated guesswork.

Also, the Druid would do well by summoning Togorah to guard you, since it has intercept to protect you from ranged attacks. Rouse the beast can be helpful for the Druid to run if she wants Togorah to guard you a second time in a round.

There are probably a bunch of other strategies you could use that I'm not thinking of.

[Aylin]

Also, the Druid would do well by summoning Togorah to guard you, since it has intercept to protect you from ranged attacks. Rouse the beast can be helpful for the Druid to run if she wants Togorah to guard you a second time in a round.

Rousing Togorah wouldn't allow him to guard a second time, unless you're using the Promo card Altar of the Iron Guard. Vigilant only lets the creature add a guard marker at the of its action phase, so it wouldn't have one unless it was Roused the turn it came into play. I don't think it would be legal for both teammates to cast Rouse on Togorah the round it came into play since the card says "you may cast this one time per round on the same creature" and in team battles each team is considered to be one player.



That said, you should focus on covering each others weaknesses as Imaginator said. If you use Zombies you'll have a bit of a penalty to mobility, so if your teammate can focus on bringing and keeping an enemy in your horde you won't have to worry so much about board control and they won't have to focus on killing. A good teammage for the Necromancer I think would be the Druid or the Wizard since they both have excellent board control. On the other hand, if you went with Skeletons I think a good teammate would actually be the Warlord. Fortified Position, Battle Standard, and Veteran tokens would all add to the survivability of your Skeleton soldiers. The Warlord's Battle Orders ability would also buff most of your Skeletons as well, and it would be cheap for that player to include many Power Strikes, Charges, Whirling Strikes, or Battle Furies to buff your undead minions. Thorg could also provide some board control and if you brought along some Vampirism it would increase Thorg's survivability a lot. If you two think that the Warlord could get enough mana to cast Akiro's Battle Cry that could be a very powerful finisher as well (since all your Skeletons would gain fast and Charge +2).

[Sailor Vulcan]

But if you qc rouse the beast on Togorah, doesn't it get another action phase that round? I mean, flipping over a used action marker is the same as giving a creature another action, and therefore action phase, isn't it? And therefore vigilant would activate again at the end of Togorah's second action phase in the round.

And Altar of the iron guard only places a guard marker on a creature when it comes into play.

What's preventing rouse the beast from letting Vigilant work again in the same round? I'm confused.

[Aylin]

But if you qc rouse the beast on Togorah, doesn't it get another action phase that round? I mean, flipping over a used action marker is the same as giving a creature another action, and therefore action phase, isn't it?

Right, but since creatures are summoned to the arena inactive (p. 9 of the rulebook), casting Rouse the Beast increases the number of actions that creature has from 0 to 1 that round. Rouse also cannot target a creature that was not summoned this round, so it is impossible to use Rouse the Beast to give a creature more than one action in a round.

Btw, Altar of the iron guard only places a guard marker on a creature when it comes into play.

Yes. If you were using Altar of the Iron Guard it would come into play with a Guard Marker. If it guarded against a melee attack or intercepted a ranged attack that round, you could then cast Rouse the Beast on it, which would allow it to potentially guard a second time in one round. But I know of no other way to achieve two guards in one round.

[Aylin]

But if you qc rouse the beast on Togorah, doesn't it get another action phase that round? I mean, flipping over a used action marker is the same as giving a creature another action, and therefore action phase, isn't it?

Right, but since creatures are summoned to the arena inactive (p. 9 of the rulebook), casting Rouse the Beast increases the number of actions that creature has from 0 to 1 that round. Rouse also cannot target a creature that was not summoned this round, so it is impossible to use Rouse the Beast to give a creature more than one action in a round.

Btw, Altar of the iron guard only places a guard marker on a creature when it comes into play.

Yes. If you were using Altar of the Iron Guard it would come into play with a Guard Marker. If it guarded against a melee attack or intercepted a ranged attack that round, you could then cast Rouse the Beast on it, which would allow it to potentially guard a second time in one round. But I know of no other way to achieve two guards in one round.

What's preventing rouse the beast from letting Vigilant work again in the same round? I'm confused.

The restriction is on the number of possible actions in one round.

[Sailor Vulcan]

Oh. You're right. I can't believe I missed that. It would be nice if that were in the target line of the card...

[Aylin]

Oh. You're right. I can't believe I missed that. It would be nice if that were in the target line of the card...

Same for Harmonize. It just seems odd that some cards have partial targeting information in separate places.

[Wiz-Pig]

Since guard stays in play until you activate a creature you can easily accomplish two guards in one round without any trickery can't you?

[Kharhaz]

Since guard stays in play until you activate a creature you can easily accomplish two guards in one round without any trickery can't you?

Yes.
Example:

Creature A guards during round 3.

During round 4 (before it is activated) it is attacked and counter attacks.

When creature A is activated in round 4 it may guard again. (and could counter attack again in that round)

[Aylin]

Since guard stays in play until you activate a creature you can easily accomplish two guards in one round without any trickery can't you?

You're right. I should have been clearer and specified that I was referring to placing more than one guard token on a creature in one round.