Strategy Guides for default Mage builds in future expansions

[darkdaysdawn]

Other games (e.g. Magic: The Gathering) have often sold their preconstructed decks (books to us) with a strategy guide enclosed.  I would like to see strategy guides in future Mage Wars expansions. 

These guides would recommend some opening strategies for each new mage (using their default book), as well as some tips on how to deal with certain threats and the general strategy and tactics the mage is designed to employ in the mid to late game.

These would be especially helpful for new players, but they could also teach experienced players some new tricks, demonstrate how new cards could be used. 

The books' designers obviously have their reasons for choosing the spells they've chosen.  Sharing these ideas could help everyone and make each expansion that much more robust.

[reddawn]

Yeah, I second this strongly.  Mage Wars, while very compelling, has a very unforgiving learning curve.  I think this could be shored up if playtesters or designers helped point players in the right direction when approaching the game.

I understand that doing something like that could be seen as "dictating" to players how to play, but I think there is room for a middle-ground.  I mean, a lot of the Strategy forums are just players trying to make sense of things, and that's a hard thing to do on your own.  MW, despite its criticism, isn't like MTG or other games really; you can take what you learn in other games and apply it to MW only so far.

So basically, designers and playtesters don't need to lead players by the hand, but you shouldn't have to study the Codex over and over to learn game basics like Traits, especially if they are meant to be intuitive.  I think that with a basic strategy guide, we could close the gap between veterans, casual players, and newbies.

[Wiz-Pig]

This gets my vote. It's takes a lot of work to learn strategy for this game by digging through forums and watching videos. Some quick ideas and tips would go a long way towards helping new players understand the game.

[Stormmaster]

I think it could be helpful, but it might predispose to seeing some playstyle, which is then just countered by another playstyle.  The less cookie cutter similar play the better.  Some of the most fun games I've played is the unexpected plays and combos that exist that aren't immediately obvious or "the norm" but work extremely well together.

Fortunately for Mage Wars the game is VERY easy to learn because of how intuitive it is.  I've had friends who never played the game up and running in under 20 min where as some games with this much detail and varied gameplay I can barely get through the rule book in that amount of time.

Some hints wouldn't hurt but discovering things on our own can be part of the fun exploration process of the game.  If they give that away it is like giving away the end of a movie or book.  I like to experiment with weird stuff and find out sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't (always have a back up plan if it doesn't!).

[Sailor Vulcan]

A problem with apprentice mode is that it only teaches you the very basics. It doesn't teach you as much about the different kinds of cards and mechanics in the game since its only two mages playing it at a time, and without their ability cards, and the game only uses half the cards of a normal game anyway.

Perhaps more important to note: While Mage Wars is very intuitive, you can't expect new players to know that right away. The reason for this is that there are a lot of things to keep track of in the game. So even though nearly everything is intuitive once you think about it, a new player that isn't used to multi-tasking in this game is going to be focusing a lot more of their thoughts on just trying to keep track of everything going on in the arena—remembering to pay upkeep costs, turning over markers, keeping track of ranges between different objects, etc.

Just last night both my opponent and I each forgot to reveal our nullifies at vital moments. My opponent when I cast a spellbound drain power, and me when I was force pushed without armor through a wall of thorns. And perhaps surprisingly, that game was the closest I've ever come to winning. I've lost count of how many games I've played and I'm bad at estimating, but I joined this forum nearly two months ago and have been playing a lot more frequently since my summer classes ended a couple weeks ago, and I even taught one of my friends how to play in real life.

I haven't won a single game yet, and I still keep coming back for more. While having a steep learning curve is daunting to most new players, Mage Wars isn't like other games in that losing doesn't make it any less fun. It's is a 1-3 hour game—quite a time commitment for someone who doesn't love it.

In other games, if you lose your first ten games then you're too frustrated and discouraged to continue. in Mage Wars, if you've even played enough to feel like you're constantly losing, that probably means you already love the game. Mage Wars is such an enriching experience that even if you mess up a lot and lose your first many games consecutively, it's still fun.

I think the problem is that people see the learning curve and are scared away because they wrongly assume the game is too difficult to enjoy. Strategy guides would probably be helpful, but I think in their introductions they should emphasize that

1. Mage Wars is dynamic and evolving; no two games are likely to be exactly alike and there are always more strategies to discover. Be adventurous and creative!
And
2. The main point of playing is to have fun, and winning/losing is secondary to that. (In fact if you're willing to play a 90 minute game a second time at all it's kind of expected that you'd like it.) So don't be afraid of making mistakes and messing up A LOT in the beginning.


One more thing: a strategy guide is a guide, not a manual. It shouldn't be taken as a be all end all authority on the game.

[Stormmaster]

I never use a 'default mage build' even with the new expansions.  But you are right, just because there is a guide doesn't mean people have to follow it.

When my friend and I were learning we quickly (as in part way through game 1) learned the apprentice book was way too limiting and while good to get a feel for the basics of the mechanics of gameplay (like moving, damage etc) it really didn't lend a feel to the true awesome power at a mage's disposal (esp w the lack of the ability card).  We used apprentice ONCE and never looked back, and that was more than enough learning time to figure out the game.

I kind of think losing though can lead to the best learning experiences, it helps you adapt your game.  Fortunately (or unfortunately depending on how you look at it) I have never lost a game yet (local meta I'm sure).  I've only played around a dozen games though, so not a large sample size.  But I am actually looking forward to when I do lose so I can figure out how to up my game to the next level.  My friend (who has lost all those games) STILL wants to play and keeps wanting more.  That is a true test of a good game, can you lose over and over and still want to play it? 

Trying new things, sometimes going defensive, sometimes going offensive etc etc.  That is the best part of different decks/mages is tweaking little things. It's a FUN learning experience (win or lose)...What worked that time?  What wasn't so hot?  Which cards have I put in but never use?  Which cards do I "go to" nearly all the time?  It IS all part of the learning curve but that can be learned while playing.  The rule book is extensive but the move and casting mechanics we picked up in a matter of a couple of rounds, it is the deeper strategy and methods that make the game so inviting and keep us coming back.

[Wiz-Pig]

I think it could be helpful, but it might predispose to seeing some playstyle, which is then just countered by another playstyle.  The less cookie cutter similar play the better.  Some of the most fun games I've played is the unexpected plays and combos that exist that aren't immediately obvious or "the norm" but work extremely well together.

I fail to see how predisposing someone to seeing certain play styles is a particular pitfall of providing strategic information. All you have to do is note that there are potentially many different successful strategies and that the information given is merely a window into the world of strategic possibilities within the game.

[darkdaysdawn]

I think it could be helpful, but it might predispose to seeing some playstyle, which is then just countered by another playstyle.  The less cookie cutter similar play the better.  Some of the most fun games I've played is the unexpected plays and combos that exist that aren't immediately obvious or "the norm" but work extremely well together.

I fail to see how predisposing someone to seeing certain play styles is a particular pitfall of providing strategic information. All you have to do is note that there are potentially many different successful strategies and that the information given is merely a window into the world of strategic possibilities within the game.

I agree.  I don't think offering a strategy guide is predisposing someone to a certain style for a new mage type anymore than providing a default deck is.  "Here's a deck idea, and the strategy guide to go with it" would be understood, I think by most, that it is presenting just one of many possibilities for the new class, but also some possibilities for some of the new mechanics/conditions/traits/attributes/creature types/etc.  It could showcase anything in the expansion.

[DrunkenSaint]

they already outline at least the basic moves/ideas, at least in the DvN instruction book I have in front of me. It is not all spelled out, but beyond an opening move you cant really spell things out too well. It is all so situational and is what makes the game so good.

[Laddinfance]

DVN was the first time we had a strategy guide for the books. If you guys found them helpful, I'll work on continuing them!