Warlord vs. Flying

[Nitz]

Hey guys,

Got my first game with the warlord yesterday.  Had a rough time fighting the Warlock.  Admittedly, it was my first game with the Warlord, which presented 2 problems.  The first being the obvious problem of not having any experience with him, the second being that my "starter" spell book didn't have a lot of spells I was accustom to having at my disposal.

That being said, I felt very underwhelmed with the warlord.  I have no doubt this is 99.9% user error, an this is not a post to suggest the warlord is underpowered nor broken.  I just thought I'd relay my thughts and see if you guys had some tips on how to fix my strategy and tactics.  

I felt very mana starved.  Again, a big issue was no harmonize in my deck.  My firs turn i put out a barracks and a archer's tower.  After that, i went for a slinger and a enchantment, but I felt very strapped from that point on.  It didn't help that the warlock used fire to smoke my archer's tower earlier, and thus hurt my mana draw.  So fire was tough on my structures, and perhaps might make me change that strategy against the warlock or a fire wizard.  Another tough issue for me was once my opponent deployed the big beastie demon.  Other than Hurl Boulder, i didn't have many answers for him.  My warlord was powerless against him.  I did make a huge mistake and move out of the zone with my goblin slingers.  he then did a sweeping attack and smoked them.  I'm not sure if fortified position would have helped, but leaving them alone was a mistake.  at that point, he had a big beasty, a fully kitted warlock, and I had a warlord and barracks, and low levels of mana.  From there, he just ground me down.  

In the future, I think tweeking the deck will help for sure, as will expeirence to avoid my mistakes.  A harmonize, teleport, and bow would help I think.  I also wonder if bringing a couple flying troops might help the warlord.  I know they aren't soliders, but the ability to get over his stone walls, pikes, and caltrops seems to be decent, as well as providing some anti flying tech.  I also know the sniper can help, but he's a lot of mana.

Any ideas from you guys on what works, or how  you'd tweek the spellbook?  I know there are other threads, so let me be more specific

does a fire build from your oppoent change your structure strategy?
Is flying a problem for your warlord?  How do you deal with it?
Which of the special charaters are worth taking? Surely all four is too many for a deck right?
any new discoveries on playing a better warlord?

I have no doubt he's pretty good.  I just think his win conitions are not as obvious, which I like.  I'd like to poke around with my old Nintendo Ice Hockey strategy of only taking skinny (cheap) and Fat (expensive) guys and leave all the medium (orcs, dwarves) at home.

[Aarrow]

I've seen successful Warlord strategies build defensively.  They summon the Barracks and Harmonize right away, then start flooding creatures.  The Goblin Slingers are cheap, and great against flyers.  You could Guard with your Warlord to protect your gobbies and the Barracks. Also, plant a Sacred Ground and Standard Bearer in your spawnpoint zone.  Use the Sniper for your large creature, he has great range to hit.  The Triplestriker is great when combined with Rouse the Beast, and can get you out of a jam.
Sniper shot if they have a facedown attached, but I haven't seen much use for the rest of his command incantations (at least not with range striking).  Save your mana for creatures.
Equip Dragonscale Hauberk and Elemental Cloak to shut down fire attacks.

Warlord is tricky.  His triple Arcane cost limits the answers he can put in the spellbook.

[reddawn]

The Warlord's base play style appears to be (I've only played Forcemaster so far, brother as Warlord) rushing out bunches of small soldiers like Grunts and a couple/few Slingers to soak any initial onslaught from the opposing mage and provide early pressure, and then select a legendary fatty that counters how your opponent reacts.  I don't think casting one very large creature with him at the very start of the game is a good idea...it locks you into a very particular way of playing, when I think the Warlord should try with flexibility until he knows what he's up against.  Starting out with bunches of small, cheap, and very efficient guys like grunts and slingers and butchers forces your opponent to react, and from that, you can then judge how to react.  It also creates a large action advantage in a hurry, which pressures the opposing mage to react, which is exactly the game you want to play.

Examples: Lots of fliers or ranged?  Get the legendary sniper.  Lots of conjurations?  Akiro's Hammer.  An enemy swarm? Get the other dwarves which specialize in zone and sweeping attacks.  A powerful flier like Adramelech or Valshalla?  Use Thorg to pull them down to earth and away from your mage.

At least in my opinion, the Warlord starts the game by testing the waters with very low-commitment units like goblins and then transitions into a particular specialist that suits his opponents.

[Nicho2222]

As warlord I generally start with the sniper and an Archer tower.  It allows you to put out a lot of damage at a great range.  Anything coming at you is usually looking at 5-7 damage dice and you'll generally get two shots before they get to your sniper.  Then I go mana flower save the 5 mana the following turn for a barracks.  Put the barracks out and start pumping out soldiers (orc butchers are one of my favorites).  After you've got a bunch of creatures your sniper is still wailing on guys from the back and your melee guys are getting veterancy by finishing them off.  Andramalach and maybe the angels might be a problem for that but I run maim wings and quicksand for such occasions.

But to tell you the truth i had the same reaction to the warlord at first.  He is all about the barracks and pumping out the melee swarm.  Fortified position is amazing if there is a fight and definately get the battle standard out there as it makes everything better.  I believe a ranged warlord might work, but you'd have to have some conjurations to buy you time and it seems slow to me.

[dexmark]

You can try this strategy:

Turn 1: 19 Mana
- Mana Crystal 5
- Iron Golem 13

Turn 2: 10 Mana
- Helm of command 4 mana (bind Charge Fast and Charge +1)
- Move Iron Golem towards the opponent

Turn 3: 15 Mana

Option 1: Iron Golem strategy
-Mage Wand 5 mana (bind Teleport)
- Cast Battle Falcon Precision (unavoidalble trait) on Iron Golem Face down 2 Mana

Option 2: If opponent has Flyer headed your way
or Get Sniper out for 15

Turn 4: 17 Mana - At this point you have a Helm of Command with fast + charge and a Teleport to either position your Golem close to your opponent.

Option 1: Mass Iron Golem - Get another Golem 13 Mana
Ring of Command 3 Mana
Mana 1 left
or

Option 2: If the Sniper went out on 3 then this is the other option:
-Mage Wand (bind Teleport) 5 Mana
- Ring of Command 3 Mana
Mana 2 left

or Teleport Iron Golem by 1 Zone 3 Mana
Mana 2 left

or Cast Helm of Command charge

That is the basic strategy. The Iron Golem is pretty scary with the Helm of Command with Charge in play + Mage Wand with Teleport.

This is somewhat an aggressive Warlord strategy.

Hope this helps..

The strategy above didn't use the outpost at all.

[MrSaucy]

I think I can help OP.

> Attack Spells

Don't use attack spells. Focus on your creatures. Everything revolves around creatures.

> Conjurations

Use stone walls to block the line of sight of your opponent's ranged attacks.
Use pike walls against an opponent relying solely on melee.
ASAP, get a barracks with harmonize and two garrison posts to give your barracks +4 channeling.
Akiro's Hammer can wipe out enemy conjurations really quickly with its 8 dice attack; use this.
Hand of Bim-Shalla, though a Holy Spell, synergizes well with the Warlord's goals.
Quicksand is a great way of dealing with annoying creatures.

> Creatures

Make a goal of summoning a creature every turn (after turn 3), either from your mage or from your barracks.
Use Goblin Grunts to charge relentlessly forward. Don't worry about whether they die or not. Think of them as pests.
Goblin Slingers are cheap but great ranged units.
Orc Butchers can be used like your Goblin Grunts, but be more careful with them.
The Dwarf Kriegsbiel makes a great Standard Bearer. (don't use against Wizard, he has lightning +2)
Iron Golem is a solid creature, great against forcemaster. (don't use against Wizard, he has lightning +2)
Ludwig Boltstorm is very situational. I haven't been successful with him.
Grimson Deadeye, Sniper is powerful but squishy. Keep him in the corners.
Sir Corazin, Blademaster is totally awesome when you pump him up. Give him Bear Strength to get the option of a 6 dice doublestrike!!!
Thory, Chief Bodyguard is good if you are playing against a creature heavy build. Keep him in your mage's zone. He can be pretty awesome if you give him a defense and taunt creatures into his zone. (Even if they miss him, he still gets a free counterstrike since he is on guard!)

> Enchantments

Fortified Position, Standard Bearer, Bear Strength, Falcon Precision. That is what I use.

> Equipment

Be sure to have Elemental Clock and Regrowth Belt (no matter what mage you are... seriously)
Horn of Gothos is your bread and butter. Use it as much as possible. Helm of Command is also very useful.

> Incantations

Not much to know here. You need the essentials (Dispel, Dissolve, Heal). Some great command incantations include Charge, Perfect Strike, Power Strike, and Piercing Strike.

> Overall

Creatures, creatures, creatures. Summon a creature every turn. It doesn't matter if it is a Goblin Grunt, just summon it if you have nothing else to do. Don't waste time with fancy trickery and pumping up weak creatures. Focus on brute force and overwhelming.

> Useless cards

War Sledge
Mangler Caltrops
Goblin Bomber
Goblin Builder
Earthquake (too situational)
Whirling Strike (too expensive, too situational)
Hail of Stones (full action? range of 1? thanks but not thanks)

[paradox22]

> Useless cards War Sledge Mangler Caltrops Goblin Bomber Goblin Builder Earthquake (too situational)Whirling Strike (too expensive, too situational)Hail of Stones (full action? range of 1? thanks but not thks)

Good write up...although I disagree with the "useless cards" quote.  I've used the war sledge to daze with great effect.  Many others you listed are also far from "useless".  Perhaps you should've said "cards you don't like".  

[baronzaltor]

> Useless cards War Sledge Mangler Caltrops Goblin Bomber Goblin Builder Earthquake (too situational)Whirling Strike (too expensive, too situational)Hail of Stones (full action? range of 1? thanks but not thks)

Good write up...although I disagree with the "useless cards" quote.  I've used the war sledge to daze with great effect.  Many others you listed are also far from "useless".  Perhaps you should've said "cards you don't like".  

I agree.  War Sledge is boss,  Mangler Caltrops are nasty since Throg can force you to walk onto them.

Also, for fliers I recommend packing a Mage Staff.. its got reach and lets you use your +1 innate melee boost, (unlike the bow) and is ethereal damage.  Ethereal damage is important because Akiro's Hammer can ONLY target corporal conjurations.  So a Wall of Fog or Wall of Fire can block its LOS and literally disable your ability to shoot anything else (since it cant LOS past them, and cant target them due to not being corporal)

[Aarrow]

I think I can help OP.
ASAP, get a barracks with harmonize and two garrison posts to give your barracks +4 channeling.

Does this work?  I thought X's "value" couldn't get higher than 3?

[Sausageman]

The problem with the War Sledge is that it takes two hands - this means that the Horn of Gothos can't be used, and that's really useful to make the most out of his innate ability.

Also, how is it no one is mentioning Royal Archers or Knights of Westlock.  Both are soldiers and you can do some really nasty things with Archers, Watchertower, Hawkeye and Warlords ability...

[Nitz]

Great discussion guys.  Thanks, and keep it up if you want!

A couple things:

I've seen quicksand on offer, and while I like that card, it does not work against flying.  That is my understanding, unless I am wrong.

I've thought about binding teleport to a wand, which seems really good b/c it costs so much to go in the deck.  The issue seems to me though that your opponent can simply dissolve the wand, and the teleport is gone.  I can't see carrying two of those for 18 points, so isn't it better to keep teleport in your book?  You only get one use, but at least you have it when that one use is really necessary.

I need to do some more thinking about the bow vs. the staff.  I'm shocked the warhammer is two handed WITHOUT reach.  

I want to give some more thoughts to the knights of westlock.  I've been mulling them over.  THey are pricey but sure do have a lot more beef than the gobbos.

[paradox22]

I'm shocked the warhammer is two handed WITHOUT reach.

IMO Sweeping coupled with a 7+ chance to daze multiple creatures makes up for it though.  

[reddawn]

The most efficient and I would argue best way for the Warlord to deal with fliers is a combination of Ivarium Longbow and some Hurl Bolder, with a Goblin Slinger or two.  There's really no reason he needs the Mage Staff when he has better in-school solutions, especially when it would cost him a massive 6 spellbook points.  If you're having trouble with incorporeal things, just use Lightning spells.  There's a reason the expansion came with 5 Arc Lightnings.  Elemental Wand is even in-school for the Warlord, so you can pretty effectively deal with a bunch of them if you really need to without losing card advantage.

After having a bunch of games against the Warlord, I don't think it's a good move to try to do your own thing when playing as him.  The Warlord should be reacting to whatever mage he's up against, thinking about the best way to deal with that specific mage.  And I especially do not think it's a good idea to mass creatures against the Forcemaster all game or in particular any other mage unless you have very good reason to; start with an Iron Golem with buffs, Helm of Command with Sniper Shot, and throw Hurl Boulders and use the Ivarium Longbow (Sniper Shot each time if you expect Block or Deflect).  The only thing the Forcemaster can really do after that is use her Forcefield, which is very powerful yet very expensive.  At this point, the Warlord can now summon a bunch of creatures for a final push to wear down the Forcefield and attempt to finish off the Forcemaster.  

The Warlord is really not a "do your own thing" kind of mage.  He can technically channel a lot of mana via his Barracks and other outposts, but a competent opponent won't let you do that.  Force Hammers and any kind of flame attack make very short work of his conjurations.  Everything the Warlord has is a specific tool for a particular kind of battlefield situation; your goal should be to try to punish a your opponent's strategy, not build your own.

[Sausageman]

I'm shocked the warhammer is two handed WITHOUT reach.

IMO Sweeping coupled with a 7+ chance to daze multiple creatures makes up for it though.  

Sweeping is only against two opponents. Really isn't that hot IMO. I would suggest you're hard pushed to find a worse weapon in fact

[piousflea]

7+ Daze is no staff of Asyra, but it does count for something in a melee to melee fight. The hammer is certainly no Galvitar or Sectarus, but its not terrible.