Crush Tokens and Finite Life

[sIKE]

So for example my Temple High Guard has been Stranglevined for two rounds and I have paid the Upkeep. The Stranglevine at the point is up 4 Life. Now Deathlock comes out in round 3. During the Upkeep phase, I pay the Upkeep for the 3rd Crush token. However with Finite Life out on all Living Creatures/Conjurations the Stranglevine does not gain any more Life. However during the next round I kill the Deathlock and then during the next Upkeep phase, I pay Stranglevine's Upkeep. Does Stranglevine now have 6 or 8 additional Life?

[Schwenkgott]

Stranglevine gets +2x Life, where x is the amount of crush tokens. The lifegain may be interrupted for some rounds, but after the destruction of deathlock, in upkeep all the denied lifegain suddenly happens at once. 4 Crushtokens means +8 Life.

[Kharhaz]

So for example my Temple High Guard has been Stranglevined for two rounds and I have paid the Upkeep. The Stranglevine at the point is up 4 Life. Now Deathlock comes out in round 3. During the Upkeep phase, I pay the Upkeep for the 3rd Crush token. However with Finite Life out on all Living Creatures/Conjurations the Stranglevine does not gain any more Life. However during the next round I kill the Deathlock and then during the next Upkeep phase, I pay Stranglevine's Upkeep. Does Stranglevine now have 6 or 8 additional Life?

[mwcard=DNJ10]Stranglevine[/mwcard]

X = the number of crush tokens.

Strangle gain Life = 2X

The life gain is a trait that is always active. There is no window to apply the effect.

From Codex
Finite Life
(Object Trait)
This creature cannot heal, regenerate, or gain Life. If the creature gained Life before it gained this trait, it keeps that Life but cannot gain additional Life. All Nonliving objects have Finite Life.


So you get to keep all the life you have. [mwcard=MW1J19]Deathlock[/mwcard] does not revert the life gained from a revealed Rhino Hide.

Now, if a creature is under the effect of D'lock and then reveals a rhino hide, he does not get the life increase. If the D'lock is destroyed the next round he would then gain the life increase. Life gain as per the trait has no window to be active, it is either active or not. When the finite life is removed you life is equal to base life + any increases.

Back to s.vine. It has life = 2X. So in your example when the finite life is removed, it would get a "surge" of life since finite life is no longer preventing the gain.

[sIKE]

That is exactly what I thought, I just wanted to me sure with the AW side of things.

[bigfatchef]

I think you are talking about bull endurance, not rhino hide 

...
So you get to keep all the life you have. [mwcard=MW1J19]Deathlock[/mwcard] does not revert the life gained from a revealed Rhino Hide.

Now, if a creature is under the effect of D'lock and then reveals a rhino hide, he does not get the life increase. If the D'lock is destroyed the next round he would then gain the life increase. Life gain as per the trait has no window to be active, it is either active or not. When the finite life is removed you life is equal to base life + any increases.

[Kharhaz]

I think you are talking about bull endurance, not rhino hide 

...
So you get to keep all the life you have. [mwcard=MW1J19]Deathlock[/mwcard] does not revert the life gained from a revealed Rhino Hide.

Now, if a creature is under the effect of D'lock and then reveals a rhino hide, he does not get the life increase. If the D'lock is destroyed the next round he would then gain the life increase. Life gain as per the trait has no window to be active, it is either active or not. When the finite life is removed you life is equal to base life + any increases.

Sounds about right

[Zuberi]

Others seem to have this covered.

[Kaarin]

Others seem to have this covered.

So did You

It doesn't say you gain the life +2x every upkeep though. You gain the life +2x once, when stranglevine is attached. However the value of the life gain is dynamic based upon x. Thus its not that you are gaining extra life each upkeep so much as the amount of life you have gained increases. If that makes sense. If Something ever removes the crush tokens you would then lose life based upon that as well.

[exid]

I have a doubt on this one.

stranglewine "gains 2x life".
- if stranglevine gets the finite life, does it looses the 2x life (back to 6)? or does it only stop to increase life?
- and if it looses the finite life, does it come back to 6 + 2x?

[Kelanen]

For all instances of Rhino Hide read Bulls Endurance...

[Zuberi]

I have a doubt on this one.

stranglewine "gains 2x life".
- if stranglevine gets the finite life, does it looses the 2x life (back to 6)? or does it only stop to increase life?
- and if it looses the finite life, does it come back to 6 + 2x?

It only stops the increase. I remember a previous conversation on this topic regarding traits with a dynamic changing variable and how they work with regards to time stamps, and I don't remember the answer or if it ever got an answer, but I do remember the intention is for it to keep the life it had at the time of deathlock and simply be denied further gains. Which seems to require the variable to have it's own time stamp. It can't update the traits time stamp as that would cause deathlock to remove all of the life gain, nor can it be grandfathered in by the traits time stamp cause then it would bypass death lock. So I guess logically we did get an answer along with the intention. Sorry, I kind of rambled my train of thought there.

[exid]

I have a doubt on this one.

stranglewine "gains 2x life".
- if stranglevine gets the finite life, does it looses the 2x life (back to 6)? or does it only stop to increase life?
- and if it looses the finite life, does it come back to 6 + 2x?

It only stops the increase. I remember a previous conversation on this topic regarding traits with a dynamic changing variable and how they work with regards to time stamps, and I don't remember the answer or if it ever got an answer, but I do remember the intention is for it to keep the life it had at the time of deathlock and simply be denied further gains. Which seems to require the variable to have it's own time stamp. It can't update the traits time stamp as that would cause deathlock to remove all of the life gain, nor can it be grandfathered in by the traits time stamp cause then it would bypass death lock. So I guess logically we did get an answer along with the intention. Sorry, I kind of rambled my train of thought there.

i'll take "stop the increase".

... and if your train of thought would pass by this topic:
http://forum.arcanewonders.com/index.php?topic=17282.0
I'm sure it would be great help!