Serious Wording problem with Mind Control

[Sailor Vulcan]

So I just had a bit of a dispute with somaddict about whether my forcemaster could reveal Mind Control on an opponent's Grizzly immediately after I was done with her action phase. Somaddict is convinced that the "action phase" always refers to the overall section of the round in which all creatures use actions, and that it never refers to the specific action phase of an individual creature. This caused him to think that Mind Control could only be revealed after ALL creatures were done acting for the round, and he got REALLY ANGRY that I didn't agree with him (that's a huge understatement, but I'm not going to go into detail about the very nasty things he said).

It just doesn't make sense to me that Mind Control, a high mana cost high level spell, supposedly a "powerful" spell, would have such a choking restriction. I've recently read a thread where it was said that most enchantments can be revealed between steps of another creature's action phase, and I think what's intended with mind control is that it can't do that, but can still be revealed between the action phases of two separate creatures in the same round.

Is there any concrete official ruling on this? Specifically something that clears up the confusion about "the Action Phase" and "a creature's action phase"?

[pixelgeek]

Its a moot point as the card wording is "between Actions phases" and doesn't reference the end of an action phase.

[Zuberi]

I believe this is the treasure for which you seek. On page 8 of the Rulebook v2.0 underneath Action Phases.

The player with the initiative takes the first Action Phase. During an Action Phase, you will activate and use one creature that you control. Then your opponent takes an Action Phase with one of his creatures, then you take another, and so on. Continue taking turns back and forth between players until all creatures in the arena have had an Action Phase.

It clearly states that each creature has a separate individual action phase.

[Laddinfance]

Yes there is a concrete ruling on this. Mind Control can be revealed any time that is not during a creature's action phase. So, this includes before or after any creatures action phase and during the ready stage. Inside of the Action Stage there are the creature action phases. Mind control cannot be revealed during one of those, but it's legal to reveal any other time.

Does that help?

[Sailor Vulcan]

Yes it does a lot. This means both somaddict and I were getting Stage confused with Phase. Thank you for clearing this up.

[somaddict]

Yeah, for the record, it appears this was officially cleared as of a week ago.

[Sailor Vulcan]

Somaddict, now that we are both aware of and have fixed our misconceptions in regards to this issue, I hope that the next time we play it will be on far more friendly terms.

See you in the arena!

[DeckBuilder]

Imaginator: that angry reaction is exactly what I got when I followed the key recent ruling in this message here.

http://forum.arcanewonders.com/index.php?topic=12326.msg25723#msg25723

The problem is there are so many already-in-the-rules questions in this Rules Discussion section (for Zuberi to quickly correctly answer) then occasionally an Important Ruling not in the rulebook or FAQ appears. These should be collected in a single thread of links like the "Wisdom of Sortilege" Strategy & Tactics catalogue thread.

How long ago was Mind Control released? Since then, we have had even more complex cards like Enchantment Transfusion. Yet the FAQ has remained unchanged since March unlike other LCGs where there is a Living FAQ with a version number (for version control unlike the "v2" rulebook) as a much needed resource (because nobody can envisage every card interaction). It's not like this hasn't been mentioned for many months.

After my opponent rage quit (because he did not know of the devastating ruling above), the game of Mage Wars next to us finished quite soon after us (so I had time to collect all the pieces off the floor) then we decided to pack the 2 boards away and the 4 of us played other games where all the rules are easy to reference (even if we have to append a Living FAQ to a rulebook as we now have the FAQ printed).

After the horrible atmosphere this caused, we decided to give Mage Wars a rest until the new FAQ eventually comes out (though I suspect we'll break when all of us have the new expansion from UK outlets). But experiences like this is a sure way to make players fall out of love with the game. Which is such a shame because it's a great game.

[Moonglow]

As well as the nice clarification thread Zuberi has just started, it seems adding a few more key words to the codex would help I. E.  Action phase, stage etc. E ery now and then there is a word that isn't in the codex, or it is, but under something else, like we couldn't find a definition of creature, but had our question answered under mage.  Some good cross referencing wouldn't go astray. There is an unofficial codex compilation on BGG. Perhaps it could be a useful foundation for this?

[Shad0w]

I believe this is the treasure for which you seek. On page 8 of the Rulebook v2.0 underneath Action Phases.

The player with the initiative takes the first Action Phase. During an Action Phase, you will activate and use one creature that you control. Then your opponent takes an Action Phase with one of his creatures, then you take another, and so on. Continue taking turns back and forth between players until all creatures in the arena have had an Action Phase.

It clearly states that each creature has a separate individual action phase.

That is 100% correct each creature has is own action phase during the action stage.

[Shad0w]

Yes there is a concrete ruling on this. Mind Control can be revealed any time that is not during a creature's action phase. So, this includes before or after any creatures action phase and during the ready stage. Inside of the Action Stage there are the creature action phases. Mind control cannot be revealed during one of those, but it's legal to reveal any other time.

Does that help?

And laddin with the full wording nice double team

[Laddinfance]

Every once in a while I'm good for an assist.