Push Direction

[TheVoice]

When a creature is pushed by a spell that does not allow a choice of direction can you choose to bash the creature into a wall even if doing so doesn't move the creature further from the push source?

[jacksmack]

Taken from the Codex.

Push
Push is an effect caused by some spells and attacks that moves the target
into an adjacent zone. Unless the effect says otherwise, the Pushed creature
must move one zone away in the opposite direction from the source of the
Push. If there is a choice of direction (such as pushing a creature diagonally
opposite, or if the source of the Push is in the same zone as the target), the
source of the Push chooses the direction.Some spells may Push in a random direction. To determine the direction,
choose one side of the board to be “North” and roll the Effect Die: a 1-3
Pushes the creature North, 4-6 = East, 7-9 = South and 10-12 = West.
A creature may be Pushed through a wall, but only if the wall does not have
the Passage Blocked trait. The Pushed creature suffers any attack from the
wall if the wall has the Passage Attacks trait. If a creature is Pushed into
a wall with the Passage Blocked trait, it is Bashed against the wall and
suffers an Unavoidable attack of 3 attack dice. Note the walls around the
outside of the arena all have the Passage Blocked trait. Note that Flying
creatures ignore walls, except for the ones around the outside of the arena.
Some creatures and all conjurations have the
Unmovable trait. They cannot be Pushed and ignore
all Push effects.

[Zuberi]

You must push them in the opposite direction from the source of the Push. If they happen to hit a wall in the process, then they are Bashed.

The only times you get a choice in the matter is:
1) The spell says you get a choice.
2) You are in the same zone as the target.
3) You are diagonally opposite of the target.

In these situations, choosing to Bash them into a wall may be perfectly acceptable.

[wtcannonjr]

You must push them in the opposite direction from the source of the Push. If they happen to hit a wall in the process, then they are Bashed.

The only times you get a choice in the matter is:
1) The spell says you get a choice.
2) You are in the same zone as the target.
3) You are diagonally opposite of the target.

In these situations, choosing to Bash them into a wall may be perfectly acceptable.

In situation 1) above does the choice of zone selected still need to follow the "push" effect that moves the target 'away' from the caster. i.e. When a Push spell or effect says 'in any direction' does this allow the caster to actually "pull" the target closer, rather than "push" the target away?

[ACG]

If it says you get a choice (e.g. "Push") then you get a choice, no matter what. You can pull them closer.

[webcatcher]

The most common example is the spell Force Push, which allows you to move the target in any direction. Towards, away,  doesn't matter.

[wtcannonjr]

If it says you get a choice (e.g. "Push") then you get a choice, no matter what. You can pull them closer.

That is the way we have been playing, but the wording of the Forcemaster's Special Ability made me wonder since it uses the term Force Pull to bring the target closer to the caster. I began to wonder if choice of direction on Force Push just meant which zone it could be pushed away from the caster, but it still required a push away.

[ACG]

If it says you get a choice (e.g. "Push") then you get a choice, no matter what. You can pull them closer.

That is the way we have been playing, but the wording of the Forcemaster's Special Ability made me wonder since it uses the term Force Pull to bring the target closer to the caster. I began to wonder if choice of direction on Force Push just meant which zone it could be pushed away from the caster, but it still required a push away.

Nope. Force Push can push them in a direction of your choice. It specifically says so.

[wtcannonjr]

If it says you get a choice (e.g. "Push") then you get a choice, no matter what. You can pull them closer.

That is the way we have been playing, but the wording of the Forcemaster's Special Ability made me wonder since it uses the term Force Pull to bring the target closer to the caster. I began to wonder if choice of direction on Force Push just meant which zone it could be pushed away from the caster, but it still required a push away.

Nope. Force Push can push them in a direction of your choice. It specifically says so.

I agree that it states a push in the direction of your choice, but does the definition of push include pull? I see two interpretation:

A) It could mean that the push doesn't have to be in the direct opposite direction from the caster, but otherwise must meet the requirements of a push. i.e. away from the caster. So this would give the caster a choice of 3 directions in most cases. All of these choices 'push' the target further from the caster, but don't limit the effect to 'directly away from the source' of the push.

B) It could also mean that we include pull in the definition of push and ignore the requirement that a 'push' moves the target into a zone further from the caster, then the caster would have a choice of 4 directions - 3 pushes and 1 pull.

I have been playing B) above that Force Push allows a "push or pull" of the target in any direction selected by the caster, but the intent could be A) that it only allows a "push" of the target in any direction allowed by a push but does not allow a "pull".

A nit picking interpretation I agree, but as I said, in combination with the "pull" wording on the Forcemaster Ability card it started me wondering.

[sIKE]

I think of it as a push, with Force Push I get the choice of direction, including "pushing" towards the zone I am in.

[Zuberi]

I think what we need to do is look back at the actual rules in the Codex entry for Push. Specifically the sentence that reads: "Unless the effect says otherwise, the Pushed creature must move one zone away in the opposite direction from the source of the Push."

The spell [mwcard=MW1I12] Force Push[/mwcard] would fall under the definition of saying otherwise, therefore it breaks the normal directional requirements. The new requirement is then stated on the card "in the direction of your choice." Choosing to push the creature towards yourself is thus perfectly acceptable.

[lettucemode]

The [mwcard=FORCEMASTERABILITYOUTLINE]Forcemaster Ability Card[/mwcard] says "target is Pushed 1 zone TOWARDS her". There is no new "pull" wording, it is still a push. Force Pull is just the name of the ability.

[IndyPendant]

Hmm, here's an interesting question I just thought of: I know the Forcemaster's ability specifically calls out not being able to pull through a Passage-Attacks wall.  But could it be used to pull a target so that it slams into a Passage-Blocks wall?

[Zuberi]

Yes it may. However, this is a rather difficult maneuver to pull off because you must have line of sight to the target and every wall with the Passage Blocked trait also blocks line of sight. Thus in order to do as you suggest, the Forcemaster would have to stand on the diagonal from her target so she could see past the wall to be used and still be able to target the creature she is pulling.

[wtcannonjr]

I think what we need to do is look back at the actual rules in the Codex entry for Push. Specifically the sentence that reads: "Unless the effect says otherwise, the Pushed creature must move one zone away in the opposite direction from the source of the Push."

The spell [mwcard=MW1I12] Force Push[/mwcard] would fall under the definition of saying otherwise, therefore it breaks the normal directional requirements. The new requirement is then stated on the card "in the direction of your choice." Choosing to push the creature towards yourself is thus perfectly acceptable.

Agreed. For Force Push I always simplified the sentence to read "the Pushed creature must move one zone in the direction of your choice". It sounds like that is how everyone else plays it as well. However, another intent would be "the Pushed creature must move one zone away in the direction of your choice."

It comes down to how we parse the word "away " when adding the new requirement "in the direction of your choice."

The community appears to be in agreement so no need to beat a dead horse.