Forcemaster Builds

[sIKE]

What is so interesting about the build, is that Shadow has a small core of about 10-20 cards to do the kill with. The rest are there to counter the others mages style. Mordoks Obelisk and Suppression Orb sucks the oxygen out of the swarm two turns after they come out, the swarming Mage is hurting very badly and must send his beasties out to kill the conjurations (if he can). It would be very very brutal to cast on the FM non-initiative turn Mordoks Obelisk for the final QC. I could see the swam literally evaporate! Boom!

My main thing about countering the FM is if you see Vampirism come out. Next round pull one or two Dispels out (in case on gets countered) and get rid of it, otherwise you will have no chance in hell of winning. I had Vampirism out and did a Battle Fury and at the end of both attacks had removed 12 points of damage (had a great roll with the second attack). Think, that is a 36 damage point swing in one turn. Uber-Brutal!!!!!!

If you are wondering: Galvitar + 3 Hands + Power Strike + Battle Fury =  Legen Wait for it.... dary!

[Koz]

How big of a swarm are you imagining in that scenario?  Having 3 or 4 creatures is manageable even with the Obelisk and Orb out and that's really all you need at once.  Sure, the mana loss hurts, but it hurt the Forcemaster to cast them too (they're not free after all).  It will be several turns before the Forcemaster gets a ROI on those cards 

The Obelisk and Orb are an excellent way of keeping a swarm in check and prevent it from getting out of hand in size, but a small "pack" will do ok.  I've never had problems maintaining 3 or 4 creatures under those conditions before, although it obviously leaves you with less mana to do other stuff     

[sIKE]

3-4 Creatures for a Beastmaster with no Mana buffs (Channeling 9) would start the round with 5-6 mana after upkeep and then if you needed to move each creature 1 space you would be left with 2-3 mana. If I move my FM two spaces one round after a Repulse the creatures are each 3 spaces away for a total of 9 mana to get them back to me. Just movement wise it would take 3 turns and 9 mana (and other 9 mana for Mordok's). If you have saved up some Mana before these conjurations come out, it will quickly be exhausted as you chase me around the board. I would then just move out of the creatures way and teleport myself and the opposing mage to the other side of the board (non-initiative round). Then the Beatdown would proceed. With both of these out, 6-8 mana drain (assuming only 1 move per critter) / round vs. a FM will result in the most violent of deaths.

As for the FM once she gets out past round 4/5 the mana there is just for the counters or Battle Fury buffs. I started banking a lot of Mana at the end part of the game, as I was just going full Melee.

[Koz]

3-4 Creatures for a Beastmaster with no Mana buffs (Channeling 9) would start the round with 5-6 mana after upkeep and then if you needed to move each creature 1 space you would be left with 2-3 mana. If I move my FM two spaces one round after a Repulse the creatures are each 3 spaces away for a total of 9 mana to get them back to me. Just movement wise it would take 3 turns and 9 mana (and other 9 mana for Mordok's). If you have saved up some Mana before these conjurations come out, it will quickly be exhausted as you chase me around the board. I would then just move out of the creatures way and teleport myself and the opposing mage to the other side of the board (non-initiative round). Then the Beatdown would proceed. With both of these out, 6-8 mana drain (assuming only 1 move per critter) / round vs. a FM will result in the most violent of deaths.

As for the FM once she gets out past round 4/5 the mana there is just for the counters or Battle Fury buffs. I started banking a lot of Mana at the end part of the game, as I was just going full Melee.

Well we could trade "what if" scenario's all day, but I can say I certainly wouldn't chase the Forcemaster three zones with those cards in play.  I know you tend to believe that beat-down builds trump all, but I disagree. 

Plus, I highly doubt there are many Forcemasters who get both of those cards into play at the same time very often, to be honest.  It's a big investment and it will slow their offense. 

Shadow, how often do you get both of these out in the same game?  Always, often, rarely, or never?

[sIKE]

What you say can be very true. I did not get to the BM as fast as I should of. I ended up in a zone with him and two smallish critters, he then cast Steelclaw and Rouse the Beast. I was working on the BM still but was taking one hell of a beating, after two rounds I threw out the Orb and the Obelisk, and was very close to death at that point. The next round was my initiative, I did the Repulse and run two zones in the opposite direction, and the rest of the game I have already described.

16 Mana is not that much quite honestly for the FM. The only upkeep item I had was the Forcefield. Which cost me 2 / rd while channeling 10. Do nothing but Upkeep for one rd (aka just Melee) and you have the 16 needed.

I am quite impressed with the build and plan to play it with a couple of minor tweaks several more times.

My question to Shadow is have you done a FM vs FM with the same basic kind of build?

[MrSaucy]

3 Hands + Power Strike + Battle Fury =  Legen Wait for it.... dary!

Correct me if I am missing something here, but you can't use power strike and battle fury on the same turn AND still attack.

[MrSaucy]

Remember 2 things if they are running unless they are the BM they cant cast creatures, and unless they are elusive you hinder the other mage so you can Force Pull them back.

Can't the BM cast level 1 creature spells as a quick action?

[sIKE]

Correct me if I am missing something here, but you can't use power strike and battle fury on the same turn AND still attack.

Shoot I was just coming over to edit and correct. I implied one thing and meant another, and of course mixed things up a bit. I did the Battle Fury one round and the Power the next round...

[baronzaltor]

Correct me if I am missing something here, but you can't use power strike and battle fury on the same turn AND still attack.

Shoot I was just coming over to edit and correct. I implied one thing and meant another, and of course mixed things up a bit. I did the Battle Fury one round and the Power the next round...

A Thoughtspore could be armed with Power Strike or Battle Fury to cast it for you.

[MrSaucy]

Correct me if I am missing something here, but you can't use power strike and battle fury on the same turn AND still attack.

Shoot I was just coming over to edit and correct. I implied one thing and meant another, and of course mixed things up a bit. I did the Battle Fury one round and the Power the next round...

A Thoughtspore could be armed with Power Strike or Battle Fury to cast it for you.

Most definitely. And with power strike only costing 2, any thoughtspore with harmonize could cast Power Strike every turn. Shoot. This stuff sounds gamebreaking...

[baronzaltor]

I wouldnt even waste the time/spellbook cost with the Harmonize.  With his own natural Channel its only 1 mana out of pocket if he does it EVERY turn.  Any round that he doesnt (due to range or having to deal with dispels/dissloves/moving/LOS) he builds up a free cast.

[sIKE]

Koz,

Another thing to take in to consideration is you need at least 3-4  in your swarm + your mage doing melee in your swarm to get through the FM Forcefield, Deflect, and Dancing Scimitar. Once the mana denial Conjurations come out to squash the swarm you will not have enough mana to deal with everything.

If your creatures go for the conjurations, Force Pull the BM to you and thwack! Move towards the FM and you can't pay for upkeep.

Almost be worth moving to the zone with the Conjuration with the mage and bringing out an Iron Golem

[MrSaucy]

Since I plan on making a Beatdown FM deck, I was wondering how well Battleforge syncs with the FM. I plan on making my FM build very heavy on enchantments, equipment, and incantations. Is it too passive to be casting a Battleforge with Harmonize on Turn 1? My strategy is to then use Battleforge to cast the cheaper equipment spells and/or the equipment spells that I don't necessarily need ASAP: force ring, defense ring, gauntlets of strength, dancing scimitar, regrowth belt.

[ringkichard]

In my very limited experience with Force Master, Battle Forge is great, but I'd skip the Harmonize.

A lot of Forcemaster's turns are spent with a Force Pull Quickcast and then a full round double strike attack (with Scimitar too, probably). This is really cheep, and you'll end up with difficulty spending all your mana. The point of playing a Forge in Force Master is that it gives you extra actions to help you spend down that mana, to make your mana consumption and your action consumption equal.

Battle Forge is an investment of one action, that pays off in actions (and a bit of mana).
Harmonize is an investment of one action, that never pays off in actions (but does make some mana, too).
As an agro deck which plans on using Galvitar as often as possible, actions are your limiting factor, not mana.


Just as a weird thought experiment, has anyone built a Forcemaster book that includes a Goblin Builder?

[nitrodavid]

I know your mage skill and ds are optional defences but is force field optional defences ie if I attack with unavoidable will you still loose a force field token