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Topics - Tokata

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Alternative Play / Magewars and Dragons - A Pen and Paper attempt
« on: June 29, 2013, 06:19:46 PM »
So,
No idea wether someone thought of this bevore but - how about using magewars as a base for a pen and paper game?
(Who has no idea what pen and paper ist: 1) Shame on you! 2) Short: Imagine a Mmo like world of warcraft without an pc, converted to a boardgame, just without a board 3) Googel it ;) )

Ok i guess every1 reading this sentence now knows what i'm talking about when is ay pen and paper (pnp) - if thats not the case: Go googel!^^

Even if the rules may seem to be long now - compared to other pen and papers - they are nothing. Also, most of them are just common sense and i feel writing them is almost not needed at all. I do it nonetheless ;)

Bevore you continue reading, i want to apoligize for any mistakes i make, i'm not a native english speaker ;)

Once again: Bevore you read this, its important you have a vast glimpse of what pnp is about

Shorts:
Exp = Experiance
DM = Dungeon Master, / Game leader
pnp = Pen and Paper

What you will find:
0 - Pro's and Con's
1 - World and Story
2 - Bunch of Rules
3 - Battles
4 - Roleplay

All this rules are just an idea and still in "the alpha" ;) - so i'm glad for any advices


0) Pro's and Con's

Pros:
- You don't need to teach your players new rules (hell if you ever read the entire the black eye rules you know how big this pro actualy is ^^)
- IF you need to explain the system to your players - it will be fast. (alot faster then the averange pnp system at least)
- The world of magewars isn't exactly filled with lore right now. If people play this as an pnp and write their adventures in the lore forum, it could fill the world with more life
- A fight system with numerous ways to individualize your characters

Cons:
- If you want to implement skillchecks for running, jumping etc - you have to invent them on your own.
- You can only play magic characters (according to the rules i offer here - you may always change this and let a warlord be a mercenary leader meele fighter if you wish to - but you have to get the rules for your own then ;) )
- If you don't want to design your own mages - only 8 characters right now

so basicly all the cons just require some effort ;)



1) World and Story:
Well thats pretty much up to the dm, but you can easily stick to the world of magewars.


Examples: For our examples, we will use 3 Mage apprentices, Raziel, Misha and Elenore, who, for different reasons - hunt the warlock cairne bloodsong. The Priestess Elenore got a dream of her god, the wizzard raziel hopes for arcane knowledge and Misha as a childhood friend of Raziel feels responsible for him, and decides to join him, so shes able to keep trouble away.


2) Bunch of Rules
Ok here is where the deal starts.

2.1) Characters
Each player select a character (a mage). Depending on how powerfull you want your people to be you may give them a number of spellbookpoints, of with they may build a spellbook. (If you want to start with a group of apprentice mages who can cast 1 spell each fight - give them 1 or 2 points only, if you want experianced archmages for truly gigantic battles and hordes of enemys give them the full 120 points)


2.1.1) Spellbook Building:
NO "Buildings" - Ofc your mage may summon a wall, but don't allow them to take spawnpoints, temples, siege weapons etc. in their spellbooks - if a mage want to take a conjuration in his spellbook judge wether or not he may do so. You may let mages have acess to different buildings at specific battles in the campain, for example defend a temple, but don't let them summon temples ;)
NO Monsters - You should be generealy carefull with monsters in mage spellbooks, commonly as with conjurations you need to decide wether or not to let it in. Personaly, i would allow the summoning of etheral creatures if one of the mages REALY wants to, but in general I recomend sticking no monsters at all. If you want you can take familiars  and mercenaris wich they not summon but who travel with them for whatever reason.
NO Equipments - Equipments are your tools to "reward" the mages - they may loot it from enemys, buy them in towns or get them as rewards for their acomplishments. The only equipment that isn't targeted by this rule is the forcemasters blade, as it belongs to the mage^^

note: On every card the dm has the last word wether or not you may include it ;)


Example: Each of our apprentice mages gets 3 Spellpoints to build their starting spellbooks with:
Elenore, the priestess chooses  Minor Heal, Pillar of Light and Pacify -  she wants to support her group
Misha, the Forcemaster chooses Galvitar, Force Blade - she wants to go for the meele fighting
Raziel, the Firewizzard chooses 3 Flameblasts - he wants to go for powerfull magic spells to destroy his foes


2.1.2.) Experiance:
You will reward the mages with experiance in form of spellbook points, with wich they may include new spells to their spellbooks. - How you want to distribute it is up to you - you may give experiance for certain monsters to the mage who killed it, to the mage who dealed the most damage, or just give experiance for damage and healing done etc., or for roleplay purposes, all up to you (if i say you, i target the dm ;) )
I recomend a flat experiance gain for every1 + some bonus experiance for those who shined in certain tasks
I also recomend the following formular:
10 Exp = 1 Spellbook Point
Monsters MAY give their creature level in exp, if you want your mages to get stronger through fighting. (so if a character kills of 10 wolfes (level 1) they get 1 spellbookpoint.

As i said, giving players experiance is all up to you.
I just highly recomend the 10 exp = 1 spellbook point formula, because getting exerpiance often keeps your players more on track then getting 1 spellbook point every evening of play

Example: After a day of play the players accumulated xp:
Elenore: 19 XP
Misha: 17 XP
Raziel: 21 XP
So Elenore and Misha both have 1 Spellpoint more to include to their spellbooks, while Raziel already has 2
Elenore decides to put another minor heal in her spellbook
Raziel goes for an fireball
While Misha decides to save her spellpoints for more a more powerfull spell.


2.1.3.) Battle:

Battles are fought in spaces, like in the magewar arena. you may obviously block some parts out, or put some walls on the battlefield bevore the battle starts. up to you

2.1.3.1.) Players in Battles:
In battle, each mage starts with his chaneling and 0 mana. Battles are fought normaly. Equipments doesn't need to be summoned. (Care: The forcemasters blade has to be summoned each battle!)
After battles you have two options -
1) each mage gets back each of his spells after battle. Pro: Multiple battles possible Con: May afflict rp usage of spells (This doesn't need to be a con, but it can)
2) Each mage regenerates all his spells once a day Pro: Spells seem rare, players will think bevore casting. If a spell is used in battle, it isn't avivable for rp purposes and vice versa Con: Multiple battles a day /Long fights are harder to pull of.
3) Each mage regenerates spells equal to 1 spellpoint per houer  Pro: Spells regenerate constantly, and players can decide wich spell they need to have back fast, and for wich spell they can wait. Rp spellcasting will get interesting con: Lategame, when players hurl realy much spells in epic battles, they will need years to regenerate spells.
4) (Warning: For this attempt, you need to chance the exp gain alot,): Players won't get their spells back to their books automaticly, but need to buy them back via experiance.

Note: I would recomend something between 2 and 3 - While they act, mages regain spells equal to X spellbookpoints / houer and if they rest for a long time (the night for example) they regain their entire spellbook)

Note: You may want to give mages acess to special one-time-use-spells - a priestess for example could have access to one resurection, wich she could cast on other mages as well as npcs  - but there is no way to refresh this spell. A brave warrior who defeated a demon avatar in the name of light may get a divine intervention stuck to him etc.

Note: You may want to change the total life value of the player mages to half, or even a third its realy high - Also you may think about halfing the channeling value (to 4/5) - Life and channeling value may be increased with experiance over time (For example 1 life = 20 Xp, 1 Channel = 50 xp, just hypotetical values)


Example to my method of spell regeneration: Our mages burned all their spells in the last confrontation. Now they walked for 2 houers - they regained spells equal to two spellbook points. Elenore chooses to regain blinding flash, Raziel gets two of his flameblasts back, while Misha still wait one more houer so she will be able to summon her beloved blade again.


2.1.3.2) DM in battle

Now this is your section. And with you, i target the dm, again.
For Battle purposes you have:

Monsters. For novice mages, even 1 or 2 monsters may proove to be a almost impossible task (Just toss a group of 4 mages with 3 spellbook points each against an earth elemental and you know what i mean) - so try to balance out the fights. let the mages feel pressure, but try not to kill them ;)

Mages. If you want a REALY powerfull opponent for your players you can toss them a earth elemental, or a horde of 200 goblins. Or pit them against a mage. Mages make great bosses, build them spellbooks, give them some adds, maybe incrase their life and they will cause huge headache to your players.

Objectives: Obviously, you may get different objectives in fights for the players. Kill the mage bevore he can cast his escape spell (kill him in 10 rounds). Destroy the gate to hell bevore it can spit out an archdemon. Defend the temple that holds back the dark forces. and so on. Obviously, if they fail, they have to face the consequences (For example to face a demon avatar, if they are unlucky)

Note: Equipments: You may attach equipments to powerfull enemys - this will leave the players with the choice: Will they try to defeat the foe with the equipment, to potentialy loot it? Or will they destroy the equipment so they don't need to fear its wrath? Keep in mind to always put some dissolves in enemy-mage-spellbooks, so they can use it if a player steals an equipment you don't want your players to have ;)

Note: Feel free to adjust any values as you feel you need it. Just inform your players you did this ;).. or not.. if you want them to have a nasty surprise - I recomend crit imunity (critical hits won't ignore armor) if you want tougher creatures. Also, you may want to equip monsters with "basic" equipments like leathergloves to make them tougher.

Note: Always keep in mind your players may want to flee of battles ;)

Note: If your players attack enemys they know they can't defeat, make sure they know they can't defeat him. if they proceed fighting and don't want to flee, don't hesitate to kill them...

Note: Once your mages are grown  a bit you may want them to have a fight with 12 goblins or some kind of mosnters you don't have enough cards for - just let them come in as reinforcements after they died

Note: You may want to modify some monsters, for example remove the "slow" of the earth elemental and grant it a quick attack. Do such modifications as you feel you need, you are the dm, you tell the story ;)

Note: You may want to stick enchantments to your npcs's so they are more powerfull.

Note: Don't use the "hinder" rule if mages want to flee


Example 1: In a fight, our three adventurers may find themself faced to 3 Knights of Westlock, the townguards, who attacked the group because raziel is accused of throwing a fireball to a peasant. (in fact, a servant of Cairne did this, but try to explain that to the angry townguards). The leader of the townguards just came out of a brothel, so he has the Bull Endurance enchantment on him. The mages now have to choose wether they want to flee, fight, or try to talk their way out of the situation. Since our three mages feel too proud to flee and don't see a way to talk their way out - so the fight agianst the three brave townguards starts.

Example 2: The three mages find themselfe faced against an earth elemental - an easy opponent for much xp, they guess. - since its slow, they can just kite it till its dead. But once the earth elemental arrives there is a nastry surprise - it can do his "two fisted power smash" as a quick action and may do it after a move, even thou its "slow" - seeing they can't deafeat such a powerfull foe our three mages decide to flee and take a run for it.

Example 3: The mages have grown in power and finaly face their foe - The warlock Cairne Bloodsong. He ist about to open a gate to hell, to summon aldramech (Say he will suceed in 10 rounds). He is defended by several firewalls, wich hinder the movement of our heroes as well as two whirling spirits and several imps and other demons.
After our heroes mannaged to fend of the demons, and get through the firewalls, there is not much more time left. Cairne almost opened the gates to hell, aldramechs voice already fills the caive. The mages wave their most powerfull spells to destroy the gate to hell - just in time,they suceed, but now they are exhausted, wounded, almost out of spells and still have to face the enraged Cairne. Will they suceed, or will their jurney end as a sacrisfice to Cairnes Demonic lords?


3) Roleplay
Well, as the world of magewars is just about to develop, and we don't know much about its lore, its pretty much up to the dm to set up the tasks for his players. Just keep in mind the spellbooks of your mages, and that they may use this spells to solve the tasks you give to them ;) Be prepared to face a teleport if you want them to climb up somewhere.




Note: Oh bevore i forget - some players tend to attack townguard and so on - make sure that while you are in town, you have some "nsc cards" (like knights) avivable for a townfight
Note: You may want to include skillchecks - you need to make this rules up on your own ;) Or maybe i update this if someone has a good idea on how to implement it ;)

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Spellbook Design and Construction / Deck lists - Style and prewiev
« on: December 14, 2012, 04:45:30 AM »
Ok most asurently i didn't make my point clear in the Topic - but i had no idea what to call it.

So basicly actualy the posted decklists are like:

1xcard a
2xcard b
.
.
.

Dunno how it is to you, but as former magic player this is very unhandy. Especialy with a growing cardbase, there will be a point where Players won't be able to know every card by heart, so if they read this card in a decklist they need to search its physical counterpart, or go to the database. Also, new players, the ones looking for deck ideas, won't know the cards by heart.
So what i want to ask: With the database comeing up tomorrow (as stated in the "online-Deckbuilder-thread") - will it be possible to get decklists like this, or is this too mcuh effort to set up?

(Sorry in advance - this is a german link, but as i just want to use it as an example not to teach magic, I think it should be ok ;) just move your mouse over the different cardnames in the white box)
http://www.mtg-forum.de/topic/99914-grixis-control/


So what do you think
-To the other players: Is it just me, or do you too think this would be a nice, usefull feature?
-To the mods/Admins: Is it possible (in matters of effort and the technical abilitys of the forum)?

-Tokata

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World and Lore / So... Magewars... what are they for?
« on: December 12, 2012, 02:17:45 PM »
So generaly the points i got were "We do Pitfights so they don't fight outside" - but what was the original reason for this?

Are the mages sanctioned? Personal Glory? Political Descisions made through fights? Boredom?

Didn't find anything in the backgroundstory for this, just that there is an institution called magewars in a special city and that it is supported by the countries / organisations of the mages who fight in there^^

Do any1 got anything more specific wich i overlooked?^^

Edit: Ok so after some time has passed without response - realy noone knows why they set up the mage wars? we get tons of background of the world but nothing refered to the game? ;) ^^ there has got to be somethign!^^

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Alternative Play / 1v1v1 - 3 Players game
« on: December 10, 2012, 09:44:20 AM »
Hey,
i wanted to ask if there are any working concepts for a 3 players game... (as we are 3 ppl playing that would be great, because just to watch could get a bit boring^^)

- as far as i thought of it the 3 player game would need a map made of triangles, kinda like the triforce from zelda (just a row of triangles more^^)

Am i totaly wrong with this idea, or is there anyone who already tried 3 players game and can tell something about it?

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General Discussion / How to learn the game...
« on: December 09, 2012, 07:32:51 PM »
Hello,
first of all: I'm not a native english speaker, so please tolerate if i write something in confusing ways^^

So the situtuation is the following:
On christmas i will drive home and get Magewars, from my hometown i will take two old friends with me to my new town for a boardgame-marathon. (We play 4-6 days in a row, all kinds of boardgames^^) - so usualy, as all the games belong to me, i know the gamerules, played the game and am able to explain everything - not so in magewars.  As i read it takes several houers to read the rules and get into the game, i would like to ask if there is a good way to learn magewars without haveing the components^^

+ As we are three players we would like to play with three players, obvioulsy. As i don't know the rules, i thought about simply adding one square to a corner, remove some fields, so we get at 4x4x4 triangle, in wich every corner start a mage - is there anything else to consider? (+ would one of the mages be in huge disadvantage / advantage in 1on1on1?)

Already thanks for the responses,
Tokata
:)

Edit: Ps: since we want to play with 3 players, wich extra material do i need? (like quickcast / action tookens etc) ( I plan to prox it with components of my other games^^)

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