Arcane Wonders Forum
Mage Wars => General Discussion => Topic started by: Coshade on June 26, 2015, 01:36:07 PM
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Scenario: Domination, no mods
Board: Wartorn Expanse
Players:
- Coshade: Druid
- V10lentray: Anvil Throne Warlord
- HarryPoppins: Straywood Beastmaster
Battlegrounds Domination: Free For All - Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBJ9qzfFAqk
Battlegrounds Domination: Free For All - Part 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJR6vAp3wIw
Battlegrounds Domination: Free For All - Part 3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T0g9xi6PaY
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For those looking for part 2 (which seemed to disappear temporarily), you can find it here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJR6vAp3wIw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJR6vAp3wIw)
Spoiler!!
I LOL'd at "The first Sslak ever dead on the internet."
*edit* Awesome so far. Still watching. Just noticed around 11:30 of Part 2 that Coshade's Vine Snapper punched an Orb to activate it, but there's a guarding Goblin Bomber in the zone. Doesn't the Snapper have to attack the Bomber? *edit again* LOL, that gets dealt with in hilarious fashion later.
*edit again* Can't wait for part 3!
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Thanks iNano for posting that! I won't spoil it for you, but I will tell you we have more games coming very soon! Gonna be recordin tonight :P
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I knew of the error, and I was waiting to see how chris was going to edit it. It would have been funnier if there was the Benny Hinn music playing.
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So just to be clear, when a sslak is guarding the orb and another creature is guarding the zone, you can melee attack the zone-guard but not the orb-guard?
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In that case, harry poppins went after the Orb guard.
When there are 2 guards in a zone, you can choose which guard to hit.
So yes, you can hit the other guard, instead of the orb guard. But you can not hit the orb until the Original Orb guardians(s) are dead.
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:) :) :)
No idea whats going on, but as always i enjoy your videos!
Can´t wait for Domination to hit Europe.
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I LOL'd at "The first Sslak ever dead on the internet."
Technically not true, if you count playtesting.
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I LOL'd at "The first Sslak ever dead on the internet."
Technically not true, if you count playtesting.
Oh that's been months! 8)
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:D Arcane Duels - Bringing awareness to Sslak murderers.
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Hi, thanks for video, nice editing :) (reset part was funny:) )
i think there was also one more rules mistake when battle fury buffed up Warlord was making second attack. he used 4 + 4 dice and i think it should be 4 + 3. if he made less damage, Grunt Goblin who had 1life left wouldn't be so sure to make an attack on guarding Ssalak.
I can't wait when Domination will be available in Poland. I want to try this mode, looks fun and better for free for all games.
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Tried to watch but the board was way too messy. From the angle you were showing it from it was hard to tell what was going on. Maybe you should use card sleeves next time. That way it's easier to tell which cards are whose and what they're doing where and to what.
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Hey guys! Just realized I never posted part 3!
Here it is ---->https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T0g9xi6PaY
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That game was thoroughly enjoyable to watch. Definitely one of, if not the, best I've seen. The 'Deal with it' and shades on the Tigu was quality, ha ha!
I was just wondering, how long did the game last in it's entirety (pre-edit)? Taking into account that it is new, new rules etc.
Thanks for sharing it with us Arcane Duels. I'm certainly looking forward to seeing a 4 for all with Intangible!
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That game was thoroughly enjoyable to watch. Definitely one of, if not the, best I've seen. The 'Deal with it' and shades on the Tigu was quality, ha ha!
I was just wondering, how long did the game last in it's entirety (pre-edit)? Taking into account that it is new, new rules etc.
Thanks for sharing it with us Arcane Duels. I'm certainly looking forward to seeing a 4 for all with Intangible!
Hey there,
Glad you liked the game!
The recording equipment and such took some time to get right. Harry Poppins didn't have a book, so he spent some time figuring out his planning phases. I would say we played for about 45 minutes (including the planning phases). The craziest part of the 3 for all is keeping in your mind what everyone is doing. I tried to zone myself to my section of the board as much as possible. I felt very similar to how I first felt when I played 1vs1, there is an adjustment period to getting all the new rules in place while strategizing. The possibilities are crazy for this game! Hope this helps!
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Hi, thanks for video, nice editing :) (reset part was funny:) )
i think there was also one more rules mistake when battle fury buffed up Warlord was making second attack. he used 4 + 4 dice and i think it should be 4 + 3. if he made less damage, Grunt Goblin who had 1life left wouldn't be so sure to make an attack on guarding Ssalak.
The warlod gets a +1 to his base attack, so all of his weapon free attacks are 4 dice.
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I thought battle fury was the same attack sequence and wouldn't benefit from + melee for the second attack made?
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Sorry Ray! I think you only get the +1 Melee for your first attack. There is no indicator in the rule book that any of the mage's Melee +1 abilities are unique.
Probably should have caught it. Sorry guys!
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I can't wait when Domination will be available in Poland. I want to try this mode, looks fun and better for free for all games.
I've been playing it and wondering if it's more fun for 3 players or more. It's a pretty crazy scenario. It's all a blast though. I'm hoping OCTGN can get Domination built into it before then end of July so we can see some team games online.
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Battle Fury used to be considered part of a separate attack action, and would have benefited from the melee +1 trait. Since the errata, it does not benefit from the melee +X, since the attack is considered part of the same attack action.
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I can't wait when Domination will be available in Poland. I want to try this mode, looks fun and better for free for all games.
I've been playing it and wondering if it's more fun for 3 players or more. It's a pretty crazy scenario. It's all a blast though. I'm hoping OCTGN can get Domination built into it before then end of July so we can see some team games online.
Hope to have something soon, we are working on it and would love to have it out soon after the Official release.
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Sorry Ray! I think you only get the +1 Melee for your first attack. There is no indicator in the rule book that any of the mage's Melee +1 abilities are unique.
Probably should have caught it. Sorry guys!
If that's the case they a player wouldn't get any buffs for a second attack such as with Bear strength or gauntlets of strength.
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Sorry Ray! I think you only get the +1 Melee for your first attack. There is no indicator in the rule book that any of the mage's Melee +1 abilities are unique.
Probably should have caught it. Sorry guys!
If that's the case they a player wouldn't get any buffs for a second attack such as with Bear strength or gauntlets of strength.
That's right! I've made that mistake in the past until someone showed me the errata. You may just be mixing the pre-errata with the new one.
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Sike I really appreciate what you do for OCTGN. It's crazy to see how much it has improved! Look forward to your domination scripting. Keep being awesome!
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Sorry Ray! I think you only get the +1 Melee for your first attack. There is no indicator in the rule book that any of the mage's Melee +1 abilities are unique.
Probably should have caught it. Sorry guys!
If that's the case they a player wouldn't get any buffs for a second attack such as with Bear strength or gauntlets of strength.
They do not get those buffs on the second attack. Currently the only way to reuse those buffs is to counterstrike, as counterstrikes are a new attack sequence and benefit from your melee bonus.
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Enjoy watching the gameplay. ;D
I just play solo at the moment...
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They do not get those buffs on the second attack. Currently the only way to reuse those buffs is to counterstrike, as counterstrikes are a new attack sequence and benefit from your melee bonus.
Would double strike or triple strike get those buffs - Like if I did something crazy like gave bear strength to a Darkfeene Hydra?
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no double and triplestrike would not get the melee bonus other than the first attack of that sequence.
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Imagine how insane bear strength on the hydra would be. Instead of being +2 dice it becomes +6 essentially.
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Fun game guys :) I was just wondering... Does the AoC give mana to the mage? The card says - spawnpoint or familiar and your mage is neither of that.
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Fun game guys :) I was just wondering... Does the AoC give mana to the mage? The card says - spawnpoint or familiar and your mage is neither of that.
You are absolutely right!
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I haven't played a single game of Mage Wars where either myself or my opponent haven't made some kind of mistake or another. Even during tournament play there's always a forgotten spawnpoint channelling, a targeting error or something along those lines. It's not surprising, as there is so much to keep track of and so much going on. This is one of the features that makes Mage Wars such an amazing game to play; there are so many levels of depth.
As Coshade said:
The possibilities are crazy for this game!
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I haven't played a single game of Mage Wars where either myself or my opponent haven't made some kind of mistake or another. [...] This is one of the features that makes Mage Wars such an amazing game to play;
Umm, yeah. To be honest, a different conclusion came to my mind...
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I haven't played a single game of Mage Wars where either myself or my opponent haven't made some kind of mistake or another.
That is one of the biggest problems that I have with teaching the game to new players, to be honest with you. The amount of upkeep each round in the late game and rule changes with different attacks and such wear on newbies. The apprentice mode helps somewhat but even that is a little too micro-management heavy for someone coming in from other games. Amazingly enough, I am mainly talking about Magic and Android players here, war gamers get a hang of micro management quiet easily. Then again, it IS war gamers.
I am sincerely hoping that Mage Wars Academy addresses this issue quite a bit. I am hoping the progression could be Mage Wars: Academy. Mage Wars: Arena Apprentice, Mage Wars: Arena full stop, Mage Wars: Domination (let's get crazy).
Definitely one of the deepest games I have played in terms of what can be done on any given turn and I still recommend it to many folks but that box sitting on my shelf scares people something fierce no matter how gentle I am with teaching it to people.
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Fun game guys :) I was just wondering... Does the AoC give mana to the mage? The card says - spawnpoint or familiar and your mage is neither of that.
It really didn't make much difference in this game. I actually lost mana on the Altar do to my incredible rolling skills and the ridulousness of the SSlak and the Usslak armor. I think I only games 2-3 mana from the Altar and I continuously summoned creatures so had the mana gone on the Barracks, it would have had the same end result. The focus of the build was a goblin rush build.
After playing that match, I'm not sure how much I like the Altar of Carnage. I think I need to try it again and find a way to get the armory out as well. The peircing from armory would have helped dramatically. With that board shape, and the 3 players, there was no where on the board I could have played another outpost.
So again we get to the big dilema of most people who love this game - finding players to play with.
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no double and triplestrike would not get the melee bonus other than the first attack of that sequence.
Sweeping?
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Same for sweeping. No exceptions for that rule.
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Umm, yeah. To be honest, a different conclusion came to my mind...
Would you care to elaborate jhaelen?
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no double and triplestrike would not get the melee bonus other than the first attack of that sequence.
Sweeping?
Blue is right, sweeping is also part of the same attack sequence. Currently the only way to get your full melee bonus multiple times in a round is if you can counterstrike.
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By the way, there's a nice chart on page 5 of the Official Rules and Codex Supplement (aka FAQ) that illustrates which bonuses apply to multiple attacks and which don't. With rare exception, things that affect the defender, like Flame +2 or Aegis or Armor, will apply to every incoming attack (including multiple strikes), whereas things that apply to the attacker, llike Melee/Ranged +1 or Vampiric, don't. "+/-X vs _____" (e.g. +2 vs corporeal conjurations) applies on every attack.
Damage type (like Adramelech Warlock's flame basic attack) and Reach and Ethereal (eg when granted by a weapon or Enchantment or Incantation) apply for all attacks (eg Battle Fury) as well.
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Hey there,
Just wanted to say that we all make rule mistakes, but most of the time they don't really matter. If you're playing in a casual setting then use the suggestion of just playing what you think is right. The point of playing the game is to have fun. You shouldn't let a rule ruin your experience with not only Mage Wars, but any game.
I put a lot of my games up on the internet and there is always some rule mistake I make, it doesn't bother me because I remember that I really enjoyed that game played. All those games are also casual and hanging out with my friends. I know we have an episode coming out with my Lifelock where I make a mistake with Bloodthirsty, we're not gonna scrap the video because of that. We had a blast and that's all the matters.
In tournaments though I am a jerk with rules. I'll be honest I stick to the letter on the rulebook and pay really close attention. I don't feel bad about calling people out in tournaments for cards like [mwcard=MW1J08]Hand of Bim-Shalla[/mwcard] (most people activate - move - attack then before rolling attack dice, decide to use bim-shalla).
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Would you care to elaborate jhaelen?
Isn't that obvious? If you cannot play the game without making (rule) mistakes, there must be something wrong with the game('s rules).
Now, don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing games with complex rules, e.g. Arkham Horror, which has an insane amount of corner-cases and non-obvious card interactions, once you play with all expansions. Or the Call of Cthulhu LCG which cannot be played without an intricate knowledge of the game's current FAQ.
To be honest, if I got to play Mage Wars as often as either of these games, I would probably make less mistakes, too, but I still think it's harder to miss them as in either of the other games. First, Mage Wars has an ever-increasing number of keywords, many of which are similar. While the Codex helps, definitions too often refer to other entries to grasp all of the implications. In Mage Wars, cards also tend to have a lot more text than either of the mentioned games.
And what seems to trip up even Mage Wars pro players: the game board is too busy. Between stacks of cards distributed across and around the board and various counters it's just too easy to miss something.
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Fun game guys :) I was just wondering... Does the AoC give mana to the mage? The card says - spawnpoint or familiar and your mage is neither of that.
It really didn't make much difference in this game. I actually lost mana on the Altar do to my incredible rolling skills and the ridulousness of the SSlak and the Usslak armor. I think I only games 2-3 mana from the Altar and I continuously summoned creatures so had the mana gone on the Barracks, it would have had the same end result. The focus of the build was a goblin rush build.
After playing that match, I'm not sure how much I like the Altar of Carnage. I think I need to try it again and find a way to get the armory out as well. The peircing from armory would have helped dramatically. With that board shape, and the 3 players, there was no where on the board I could have played another outpost.
So again we get to the big dilema of most people who love this game - finding players to play with.
I know, that it did not make that much of a diference, besides, you were using that mana mostly for creatures... so as it was on the barracks... I just wanted to be sure, if I did not miss any errata on this card :)
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Would you care to elaborate jhaelen?
Isn't that obvious? If you cannot play the game without making (rule) mistakes, there must be something wrong with the game('s rules).
Now, don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing games with complex rules, e.g. Arkham Horror, which has an insane amount of corner-cases and non-obvious card interactions, once you play with all expansions. Or the Call of Cthulhu LCG which cannot be played without an intricate knowledge of the game's current FAQ.
To be honest, if I got to play Mage Wars as often as either of these games, I would probably make less mistakes, too, but I still think it's harder to miss them as in either of the other games. First, Mage Wars has an ever-increasing number of keywords, many of which are similar. While the Codex helps, definitions too often refer to other entries to grasp all of the implications. In Mage Wars, cards also tend to have a lot more text than either of the mentioned games.
And what seems to trip up even Mage Wars pro players: the game board is too busy. Between stacks of cards distributed across and around the board and various counters it's just too easy to miss something.
Or maybe your attitude towards rules mistakes is a little too harsh. Rules mistakes don't happen every game. I don't know about everyone else, but at least in my experience they're usually things that are easy to rectify, like forgetting to increase your channeling after you cast a mana crystal. If my opponent makes any more serious mistakes than that, I let them know immediately so they can correct it. If there's any disagreements (which doesn't happen often) we look it up in the codex or the rule book.
And this is coming from the guy with ADHD. Mage Wars isn't a game that a beginner is going to completely get right away. It takes practice to learn. And that's okay. A beginner will still understand the rules well enough to have a great time playing mage wars casually, even if they do make rules mistakes.
Of course, there's also the matter of the game only being three years old. Even some of us pro players have room to improve. Every once in a while I forget something or become unsure of something, and when I do I just look it up in the codex or the rules supplement. It doesn't happen that often, but when it does I realize that I've forgotten something and what I've forgotten.
I honestly think that we should use block formats to make Arena organized play more accessible to beginners. By block format I mean a format where only cards from the core set and zero, one or two expansions are allowed.
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just to add altar of carnage doesnt trigger with the warlord, he is no soldier or?
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just to add altar of carnage doesnt trigger with the warlord, he is no soldier or?
Correct. And ditto for a Warlord using an ([mwcard=MW1Q13]Ivarium Long[/mwcard]) bow trying to use an [mwcard=FWJ02]Archer's Watchtower[/mwcard] (doesn't come up in this video, but I saw another post that might have hinted that this could work... but the Warlord isn't a soldier, so it doesn't work).
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why did the druid only channel 1 v'tar per round shouldn't it be 2 with lower orb and the glaxxus.
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Isn't that obvious? If you cannot play the game without making (rule) mistakes, there must be something wrong with the game('s rules).
Well, I wasn't expecting that. I haven't seen much, if any negativity towards Mage Wars in this forum.
I've enjoyed playing, making mistakes, having discussions about rules, checking the codex, rulebook, supplement and posting questions here. It has all added to the excellent experience of playing and feeling a part of such a unique and amazing game.
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I like the complexity of MW for the great number of possibilities it opens. After MTG, Jihad, Android,... I think I found my game!
I surely make a few mistakes, I have sometimes questions (allways quickly answered here!), that's part of the experience.
But I must agree with Jhaelen, that rules and cards aren't allways organised as clear as they could be, and that 3 different keywords could sometimes be reduced to 1 with no game loss but only fluidity benefit.
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Rules mistakes don't happen every game.
Note that I was replying to adanaz who said he hasn't yet played a game without making any rules mistakes. I haven't either. It's definitely encouraging that you have!
Here's a little challenge: Point me to a YouTube video of a match where no rules mistakes have been made!
P.S.: I realize that I may sound often overly harsh, but in fact, I really enjoy playing Mage Wars. However, it doesn't make sense to ignore the weak points of the game. As enthusiastic fans, we have a tendency to wear rose-coloured glasses when looking at our favorite games.
But any (perceived) weaknesses of the game should be pointed out and discussed, especially here in this forum. I think Arcane Wonders have shown that they care and react to criticism to make Mage Wars a better game.
It's good, though, that you're pointing out that Mage Wars is still a young game compared to the ones I mentioned. That, and Arcane Wonders is quite a small company, so there's only so much that can be done in the short term.
MtG also went through a major overhaul at some point to get rid of superfluous keywords and streamlined their rules. They also started to release simplified starter packs at some point to make it easier to get into the game. Of course WotC had a big advantage over Arcane Wonders: Almost limitless resources.
But if Mage Wars is to survive the next decade and escape from being very niche, it will need to go through a similar process. Despite my personal dislike of the Acadamy set(s), their release is a necessary step in that direction, and I definitely hope they'll be a big hit and attract a lot more players.
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But any (perceived) weaknesses of the game should be pointed out and discussed, especially here in this forum. I think Arcane Wonders have shown that they care and react to criticism to make Mage Wars a better game.
I agree, very good point.
However, it doesn't make sense to ignore the weak points of the game. As enthusiastic fans, we have a tendency to wear rose-coloured glasses when looking at our favorite games.
Another good point. I'm sure that Arcane Wonders appreciate all of the feedback.
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Here's a little challenge: Point me to a YouTube video of a match where no rules mistakes have been made!
P.S.: I realize that I may sound often overly harsh, but in fact, I really enjoy playing Mage Wars. However, it doesn't make sense to ignore the weak points of the game. As enthusiastic fans, we have a tendency to wear rose-coloured glasses when looking at our favorite games.
But any (perceived) weaknesses of the game should be pointed out and discussed, especially here in this forum. I think Arcane Wonders have shown that they care and react to criticism to make Mage Wars a better game.
It's good, though, that you're pointing out that Mage Wars is still a young game compared to the ones I mentioned. That, and Arcane Wonders is quite a small company, so there's only so much that can be done in the short term.
MtG also went through a major overhaul at some point to get rid of superfluous keywords and streamlined their rules. They also started to release simplified starter packs at some point to make it easier to get into the game. Of course WotC had a big advantage over Arcane Wonders: Almost limitless resources.
But if Mage Wars is to survive the next decade and escape from being very niche, it will need to go through a similar process. Despite my personal dislike of the Acadamy set(s), their release is a necessary step in that direction, and I definitely hope they'll be a big hit and attract a lot more players.
Hey Jhaelen, we do make a lot of mistakes, and I'm sorry that those mistakes have contributed to the way you feel about Mage Wars.
However, You're not unjustified in your opinion by any means. Mage Wars is an incredibly complex game and thus is prone to more mistakes than simple streamlined games like MtG. Another thing to point out is this game is very different than most on the market and since it doesn't have the mountain of past mistakes to stand on we have the responsibility of being the ones to endure the mishaps. You're right about MtG when it first came out, it was ugly and incredibly broken; even now they have to ban their own cards (usually 2-3 cards a block) from tournaments because there were unexpected consequences of keywords and balance.
From a design perspective you have a critical eye when it comes to a game's fluidity and effectiveness. Rather than a forum debate, I suggest signing up to be a playtester. I've had many hard criticisms on cards and rulings, and when I brought them up to Aaron, he was incredibly receptive. They keep an open mind at AW and I'm sure they'd love to hear your opinions.
In final, there's a lot of players on the forums who love Mage Wars perhaps a bit too much :-p
We may make these videos but we also make mistakes, we're still learning and we don't cut our misplays because we want people to learn from them.
The reason there was debate on this thread is because your words pointed fingers at all players and said they also make flaws while battling it out. By making an extreme statement about all videos or games played you make yourself a target to argue with.
Whether you're right or wrong about all videos of Mage Wars put up on the internet I wouldn't lump all players together into one pile. There are some excellent players out there who have spent hours honing their skills so that they don't make mistakes. I can attest personally for Sailor Vulcan, I've never seen a misplay from him.
Just my opinion, I'm not lashing out or anything, you're right, we screw up and we strive to fix it. I'm simply suggesting/asking that you take your critical thoughts and apply them to the development of the game. It's a good skill to have :)
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While I usually don't make rules mistakes per say (and when I do I usually catch it fairly quickly), my ADHD still rears its ugly head in some situations. Just the other day I was playing an arraxian crown warlock, and I forgot to make the demon I summoned into a bloodreaper during the early game. My opponent and I decided to count the game as two games, with the first one being my loss by forfeit. Then he let me make my bloodreaper and we continued where we left off.
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And what seems to trip up even Mage Wars pro players: the game board is too busy. Between stacks of cards distributed across and around the board and various counters it's just too easy to miss something.
There are mage wars Pro-players?? When did this happen?
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Hey, look at that guys. We made the front page of the Arcane Wonders site!
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I saw that yesterday. I'm internet famous...