Arcane Wonders Forum
Mage Wars => Spellbook Design and Construction => Topic started by: Borg on October 25, 2015, 12:17:07 PM
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Out with the old, in with the new.
The old Forcemaster strategy of coming in fast and hard, swinging Galvitar and Scimitar has seen better days.
Most players know how to handle that now.
Disarm her Galvitar, Dissolve the Scimitar, Dispel her Bear Strength and put an Agony on her and you have pretty much taken away her bite.
So, I wanted to design a new book for her, no longer focused on her as a melee fighter but rather as a finesse orchestrator who lets some choice creatures do the heavy lifting.
A strategy focused on her oft forgotten ability : Force Pull.
If you take a closer look at it you'll see that it is actually a very strong ability.
It would already be good at (1-1) range but at (1-2) range it is simply very powerful as this means that she can control the entire arena from within one of the centre zones.
Another aspect that makes this ability so good imo is the fact that it has so few counters.
Dissolve the enemy's ( likely single copy of ) Eagleclaw Boots and he probably has nothing else left to stop you from using it.
A Cloak of Shadows can reduce your range but not stop the use of it altogether.
And also, the fact that Force Pull is just a "Force" spell and not an incantation for instance means that it can get past a Nullify whereas Force Push and Teleport cannot.
All this to say, the FM can do something really tricky and powerful that no other mage can do and maybe this aspect of her has not been explored thoroughly enough yet.
Time to do so. :)
As I started playing opening after opening it was amazing to see how this continually led me to new cards and stronger openings.
I posted a spellbook named Slingshot here earlier but that book was simply the beginning.
It has evolved a lot since then and has, in my humble opinion at least, become a very fast and dangerous book.
The book now focuses on the excellent synergies between Force Pull, Teleport Trap, Spiked Pit, Astral Anchor, Tanglevine and Nullify.
But before we go into details about different openings, how these cards interact with each other and my reasons for including each card in the book let's take a look at the book first.
SPELLBOOK UPDATED 22/6/16
[spellbook]
[spellbookheader]
[spellbookname]Spiked Anchor[/spellbookname]
[mage]Forcemaster[/mage]
[/spellbookheader]
[spells]
[spellclass]Attack[/spellclass]
[mwcard=FWA02]2 x Force Hammer[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1a11]2 x Pillar of Light[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKA01]2 x Surging Wave[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Conjuration[/spellclass]
[mwcard=DNW02]2 x Wall of Bones[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1j22]1 x Tanglevine[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNJ10]1 x Stranglevine[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Creature[/spellclass]
[mwcard=mw1c34]1 x Steelclaw Grizzly[/mwcard]
[mwcard=DNC03]1 x Devouring Jelly[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWC16]1 x Thoughtspore[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Enchantment[/spellclass]
[mwcard=mw1e38]2 x Teleport Trap[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX1CKE05]2 x Spiked Pit[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWBG1E01]2 x Astral Anchor[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWA01E02]2 x Arcane Ward[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e29]1 x Nullify[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e16]1 x Force Hold[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWE07]1 x Mind Control[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWE05]1 x Forcefield[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX2FFE04]1 x Brace Yourself[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e10]1 x Decoy[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e36]1 x Rhino Hide[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e01]1 x Bear Strength[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1e05]1 x Cheetah Speed[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWE03]1 x Falcon Precision[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Equipment[/spellclass]
[mwcard=FWQ04]1 x Galvitar, Force Blade[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWQ01]1 x Dancing Scimitar[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1q06]1 x Dragonscale Hauberk[/mwcard]
[spellclass]Incantation[/spellclass]
[mwcard=mw1i06]3 x Dispel[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i07]3 x Dissolve[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i12]2 x Force Push[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i28]2 x Teleport[/mwcard]
[mwcard=FWI09]1 x Steal Equipment[/mwcard]
[mwcard=mw1i26]1 x Sleep[/mwcard]
[mwcard=MWSTX2FFI03]1 x Disarm[/mwcard]
[/spells]
[cost]Total cost: 120 pts[/cost]
[/spellbook]
Different openings :
Let's assume the enemy mage stays as far away as possible. ( ie in his starting corner )
If he comes closer that should just make things easier for the FM.
Fast aggro opening :
R1-20: Steelclaw Grizzly (3) - FD Astral Anchor in NC (1)
R2-11: Double move Grizzly to NC - double move FM to NC - Final QC FD Spiked Pit (9)
R3-19: move FM to FC - play FD Teleport Trap in zone adjacent to enemy mage (17) - QC Force Pull and draw enemy mage into Teleport Trap (16) - Trigger Trap and teleport mage into FD Spiked Pit (14) - Trigger Pit (9) - Attack with Grizzly.
Result : 11 dice + Stuck.
Controlled aggro opening :
R1-20: Steelclaw Grizzly (3) - FD Brace Yourself on FM (1)
R2-11: Double move Grizzly to NC - double move FM to NC - Final QC FD Astral Anchor (9)
R3-19: Guard with Grizzly - Devouring Jelly (6) - Final QC FD Spiked Pit (4)
R4-14: move FM to FC - play FD Teleport Trap in zone adjacent to enemy mage (12) - QC Force Pull and draw enemy mage into Teleport Trap (11) - Trigger Trap and teleport mage into FD Spiked Pit (9) - Trigger Pit (4) - Attack with Jelly - Attack with Grizzly - 4 mana left to turn Astral Anchor Face up if enemy mage tries to Teleport out on same round.
Result : 16 dice + possible corrode + Stuck.
Let's take a closer look at the enemy mages' options at that point and how the FM should anticipate.
The enemy mage is Stuck and anticipates that the FD enchantment is Astral Anchor.
How can he get out of there ?
First he will have to Seeking Dispel the FD Anchor.
Then he can Teleport out.
So he will need both actions to do it and it will have to be in that specific order because if he tries to Teleport right away during the first QC phase the FM will reveal the Anchor before the Teleport resolves and thus cause the Teleport to fizzle.
That means that even if the enemy mage has Initiative, I get my First QC phase before he can cast his second spell, so :
- enemy mage : Seeking Dispel Anchor
- FM : put Nullify on enemy mage
- enemy mage : teleport fizzles and he's still in the kill zone
- FM still has an action left to pull any Guard which could show up out of the kill zone so that the Jelly and Grizzly can hit again for 12 dice + corrode chance.
Even if the enemy mage does get out of the kill zone, no problem, play another Spiked Pit and Pull or Teleport Trap him back in.
What impressed me most while trying out all kinds of different situations is that every which way the enemy turns, it's impossible to get away from the FM and his Pulling and Teleporting tricks.
If the enemy mage stays in the kill zone, great.
If he gets out, it's just for a turn or so and he will likely be thrown into a new Spiked Pit next.
Something else I noticed is how "affordable" all these actions are in terms of mana spent.
Teleport Trap + pull is just 5 mana total to move a creature 3 zones.
Try that with Teleport and it costs you nearly double ( 9 mana )
That 10 channeling of the FM is really a boost considering he's not spending any upkeep costs ( early on ) in this strategy as opposed to a solo strategy. That's probably a hidden advantage in this strategy too.
Let's take a closer look at some of the cards now and why they're included :
Astral Anchor
Careful with this card. She's trickier than you might think. Yes, when the enemy mage is in that zone he cannot Teleport out of it, but when he gets out, you cannot teleport him back in either !
And that's one more reason Force Pull is so good.
While every other mage would need a spell with a Push effect like Force Push or Surging Wave all those spells cost sbp's, cost more mana and can either be countered ( Force Push ) or are not 100% reliable ( like Surging Wave ) while the FM is the only mage who can pull you back into a zone for no sbp's, just 1 mana and with 100% certainty ( if there are no Eagleclaw Boots to dissolve first etc of course )
Tanglevine, Force Hold, Stumble
I'm sure everybody will see the synergy between a Tanglevine and Astral Anchor.
Let the enemy mage spend his Teleports (unsuccesfully) first, then pull him back into the kill zone and when the Stuck counter wears off, replace it with a Tanglevine.
Force Hold can achieve the same result but has an expensive upkeep and is probably best used to neutralize a heavy hitter outside of his mage's Dispel range ( or behind a wall )
Teleport Trap can help you putting that creature there.
Stumble has its special uses as well and can be just as effective in holding a creature in place.
Enfeeble ( EDIT : removed from spellbook. Although a very strong card, sometimes becomes useless when enemy mage is pinned down anyway, so it becomes redundant and the 4 sbp's can be put to better use. )
In this book this is an absolute "must Dispel" card for the enemy mage.
Not only does it limit his movement, likely keeping him very close to the death zone and thus allowing me to get him back in it with just a Force Pull for 1 mana but it can also take away one of his actions if he decides to move.
Dispelling this means one less Dispel in his book and if he runs out of Dispels, how is he going to deal with Forcefield ? :)
Wall of Bones
The book's answer to Wizard's Tower. Put a Wall between the Tower and your kill zone and proceed as planned. The wall should hold at least a couple of rounds before giving in, if the mage is willing to pump mana into that effort, that is. When destroyed, simply play your second wall.
Cheetah Speed
A very important card.
Included primarily as a counter to Enfeeble. Being Enfeebled would obviously hurt this strategy big time. Instead of just dispelling it, it may be better to just leave the Enfeeble in place, as he might have multiple copies anyway.
Being Fast is obviously also a big advantage when playing a postioning game ( to be able to move two zones to a position from where you can Pull )
Another advantage is that you can stay far away at range three, move two, probe for a Nullify and Dissolve his Eagleclaw Boots all in one go :)
Decoy
This is my first book ever with a legitimate reason to include a Decoy.
Usually, a Decoy can be replaced by something better.
Of course it is a great card to probe for a Nullify and either exchange it as a 2 for 4 mana or if there's no nullify you're guaranteed to get your 2 mana back and you can leave the enchantment FD on the enemy mage until you need the mana and to play some mind games with him.
But the real reason this book needs at least one Decoy is because you need a way to instill some doubt in your opponent and make him hesitate before using his Seeking Dispel.
Without a Decoy he just knows that every FD enchantment is just a Spiked Pit or Astral Anchor especially when you have played each other a few times and you start to get to know each other's book. Decoy brings doubt and uncertainty.
Pillar of Light EDIT and UPDATE
Please see post #25 in this thread for more details on this spell's role in the book.
I could be wrong of course, but based on what I've learned from the book so far, I think this strategy looks very solid and could spell trouble even for the Wizard. :)
We'll see. ;)
Thanks for reading this far, I hope you enjoyed it.
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Looks like another amazing spellbook from you!
Will give this a try and then give feedback.
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Interesting ideas and cool style! :)
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cool book.
And also, the fact that Force Pull is just a "Force" spell and not an incantation for instance means that it can get past a Nullify whereas Force Push and Teleport cannot.
Is this correct? :o I kinda use it to force out a nullify :-[
I always saw it as an incantation, just as the wizards zap is an attack spell. And if it is correct, was it intended like that?
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The Vader Force Choke move cannot be deflected, unless you have claw on your boots.
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The "spellbook design and construction" section is not what it used to be anymore, is it ?
Besides 3 short appreciative reactions, nobody seems to have anything substantial to say about this altogether "different" take on how to play the Forcemaster.
That's pretty disappointing, especially considering that presenting "new spellbooks" is what this section is all about and a huge part of what makes MW so attractive to a lot of players.
I would understand the "cold shoulder" if the book were simply bad and the strategy had been repeated at nausea but I've been playing MW long enough to have a certain level of understanding of what constitutes a "good and dangerous" book as opposed to a "bad and punchless" one and whether a strategy is fairly "new" or rather "mainstream" and imho this book is (relatively) new and certainly has potential. It's fast, can be highly disruptive and can deliver a punch.
I expect solo mages to have a really rough going against it.
Buddy mages aren't much better off as their buddy can possibly be "parked" outside of their reach.
Swarm seems to be the toughest match up and would likely require quick and decisive action vs the opponent's Spawnpoint or elimination of the enemy mage before the swarm becomes overwhelming.
These were all points that I figured would be interesting to talk about and discuss here, but I guess I was wrong.
I don't blame anyone though, it's your time and time is precious.
I just think I will be taking the same approach from now on, so I won't be spending a big part of a sunny sunday afternoon anymore either to type this all up and provide a nice and (hopefully) interesting read and generate some fun MW discussion.
After all, my time is precious to me too ;)
Now that I got this off my chest and said my thing, I can let it rest and move on.
No hard feelings.
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I don't really see it the same way brother, and maybe it's just a difference of opinion. I see books get put up here a lot, and after the first day or two not many get responses past the first few. The ones that do get tons of responses are either tourney winners (weighted training clothes, straywood aviary, e etc) or books that change the meta in some drastic way (like the Watergate wizard, some of laddinfances intersting takes on making the warlord viable, etc) or books from legendary players (read anything by Charmyna) or books that we see in video ( the arcane duels guys for instance). Those books are usually discussed a lot and rehashed or edited in community form.
Personally I can't stand forcemasters, either playing as or against them. I can say that your book has me wondering how my druid would stop it, I've got many wonderful ideas from it, not to mention the fact that you let someone know that force pull is not nulify relevant!
I think the vast majority of the idea flow here is offline, I mean check out the views, folks have seen and read the book.I think you are having a bigger impact than you think you are, we all are. Even with no responses the fact that there are books here is super helpful to new players!
You should be happy, whenever I see a book blow up with responses it's because the other players think it needs a ton of work before it's ready. Everyone just said your book way great, I think it's great, I think some of my books can beat it, but that's the beauty of it all isn't it?
Another issue is that we are in the middle of a meta change. Two huge sets of resources just dropped (or are about to) into out laps and I don't know about you, but I'm trying to find room for hurl meteorite and dragons breath in several of my books right now, along with preparing for domination as best I can. I would say don't be discouraged. I love reading everything posted here and you personally make many viable points. Either way I'm going to keep them coming, my tournament druid is gonna get posted soon, and I'd love to hear what you've got to say about it. I don't know bro. Maybe I'm just too laid back
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Hey Borg,
Sorry to disappoint you. I want to give it a try first before I give feedback. It looks very solid. Also, it's a conglomeration of two of your previous book postings about which there was a goodly amount of feedback and all three were posted in rapid succession.
From what I've seen, Forum activity comes in spurts. There's a lull right now.
You have a great deal of well thought out comments and tactics for how the whole thing works together. I've read it all and am still digesting. I haven't had time to try out any of them due to frantically trying to build and practice for The Dude's Mage Roars. Believe me, if I had drawn Forcemaster as one of my mages I would be trying all of them...but I didn't :(
My initial concern, having not done any playing of the book, is what happens when they don't try to escape and just kill your creatures? I'm thinking of a few mages like Sharkbait's Adramelech Warlock that would just double flameblast your bear and then turn on you with the rest of them.
Additionally, I think that Fog Bank will be problematic for you as well...not that many people run it. If this book is successful I think you will have forced people to include a few more walls.
Finally, I just want to mention that "no one is paying attention to me....I'm going to do the same to you...no hard feelings" is a very passive aggressive statement. I do appreciate your contributions to the community as I think many others do as well. Please don't be angry.
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cool book.
And also, the fact that Force Pull is just a "Force" spell and not an incantation for instance means that it can get past a Nullify whereas Force Push and Teleport cannot.
Is this correct? :o I kinda use it to force out a nullify :-[
I always saw it as an incantation, just as the wizards zap is an attack spell. And if it is correct, was it intended like that?
It is specifically an untyped spell. It has a subtype, force, but no type. Yes this was intentional.
As for the book it seems to be a different application of the "tele-pit" strategy. It is vastly superior to my attempt to use the Forcemaster to make someone "sticky". But part of the issue there is that I was enthralled with the Earth Elemental.
Back on topic, I see this book having a large vulnerability to [mwcard=MW1W04]Wall of Thorns[/mwcard]. Now I realize that many may see that tactic as a bit of a gimmick but it is very bad for a Forcemaster. Even [mwcard=FWE05]Forcefield[/mwcard] doesn't protect as much as you'd like since each push is 5 attacks.
It also seems that you're relying on your aggression to get your opponents mind off killing you. You only really have [mwcard=FWE05]Forcefield[/mwcard] and your natural deflect to keep yourself alive. I say this because there are probably a couple books out there that can respond to your tactic by rushing you, and succeed.
It is a very aggressive tele-pit book. Which is great, most I'd seen in the past were very passive untill they were ready to "drop" you into the pit.
Had you thought about the power of [mwcard=DNJ10]Stranglevine[/mwcard] when you've [mwcard=MWBG1E01]Astral Anchor[/mwcard]ed the zone?
Did you pick the [mwcard=DNW02]Wall of Bones[/mwcard] just because of its high life? For one mana more you could have [mwcard=MW1W02]Wall of Stone[/mwcard].
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You should be happy, whenever I see a book blow up with responses it's because the other players think it needs a ton of work before it's ready. Everyone just said your book way great, I think it's great, I think some of my books can beat it, but that's the beauty of it all isn't it?
That was actually what I was thinking too. I saw the book and didn't have anything usefull to add. :P I would like to try the traps since I've never done it before though so chances are big I'll try making a similar book.
And indeed, domination draws a lot attention now. ;)
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RomeoXero, Puddnhead,
Thank you for the friendly and understanding reactions. Much appreciated.
I just want to mention that "no one is paying attention to me....I'm going to do the same to you...no hard feelings" is a very passive aggressive statement.
As to the above, you're right, I shouldn't have done that, sorry.
Back on topic, I see this book having a large vulnerability to [mwcard=MW1W04]Wall of Thorns[/mwcard]. Now I realize that many may see that tactic as a bit of a gimmick but it is very bad for a Forcemaster. Even [mwcard=FWE05]Forcefield[/mwcard] doesn't protect as much as you'd like since each push is 5 attacks.
I agree, the two Brace Yourself's are probably not going to cut it in that respect and it's undoubtedly better to have some "sticky" armor. I added the obvious piece of choice : Dragonscale Hauberk.
It also seems that you're relying on your aggression to get your opponents mind off killing you. You only really have [mwcard=FWE05]Forcefield[/mwcard] and your natural deflect to keep yourself alive. I say this because there are probably a couple books out there that can respond to your tactic by rushing you, and succeed.
Good point.
Of course, the book has a little more than just the Forcefield and the Deflect ability to stay alive.
There's also Dancing Scimitar, 2 Brace Yourself and a Block but I did take your remark into account and added a Fumble as well as the Hauberk.
Had you thought about the power of [mwcard=DNJ10]Stranglevine[/mwcard] when you've [mwcard=MWBG1E01]Astral Anchor[/mwcard]ed the zone?
At first, I dismissed this card because it's 4 sbp's but then thought about it some more and figured it did make sense to have one, since I'm planning to pin the enemy mage down with a Tanglevine once he's run out of Teleport's anyway, so using a Stranglevine instead and dealing extra damage might be worth the additional two sbp's.
To help keep the Stranglevine alive I also added a Fumble, ( CORRECTION This does not work on unmovable creatures as pointed out below ) a multipurpose useful spell ( and cheap for a FM ) that also can help by preventing damage on my mage and creatures and I need more of that, right ? ;)
Did you pick the [mwcard=DNW02]Wall of Bones[/mwcard] just because of its high life? For one mana more you could have [mwcard=MW1W02]Wall of Stone[/mwcard].
I'd like the 3 armor but at 4 sbp's each I really cannot afford them imo.
The Walls of Bones do an excellent job as well for just half the sbp cost.
I also added a Sleep and Disarm while at it.
Sleep on a Spore can be quite nasty and with the reduced movement capacities of the enemy mage it should be easier for a Spore to stay out of harm's way and live longer, thus being more effective as well.
Disarm can also be quite annoying on a spore, especially against another FM for Instance ( Disarm his Galvitar )
To make room for the necessary 10 sbp's I removed 1 of the Tanglevines and two lower level priority cards which were rather expensive for this book to begin with : Enfeeble and Vampirism.
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I prefer Wall of Earth to Wall of Bones for simple reason. It's immune to lightning and flame. I once imprisoned Adramelech (went himself into corner and I removed his flying first) in Wall of Earth and enemy couldn't do anything about it (Adramelech Warlock whose demons had either Bloodthirsty or flame attacks only).
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This looks like a good opening. :)
I wondered if Astral Anchor is necessary or if it isn't ok to let him teleport out and then simply TeleTrap him back. Just realized that TeleTrap also synergizes with Tangle/Stranglevine. Looks nice.
Also, I was thinking about how much trouble this FM might have with armor (no Rust to be specific) but the fact that the Jelly is there from the beginning looks promising.
My FM simply uses Pull+Wall to separate the opponent from his creatures - less effort but also less deadly. This looks like a probably better alternative. Will definitely test that.
Have you run into any troubles or what are your current "problems" with the deck ?
Controlled aggro opening :
R1-20: Steelclaw Grizzly (3) - FD Brace Yourself on FM (1)
R2-11: Double move Grizzly to NC - double move FM to NC - Final QC FD Astral Anchor (9)
R3-19: Guard with Grizzly - Devouring Jelly (6) - Final QC FD Spiked Pit (4)
R4-14: move FM to FC - play FD Teleport Trap in zone adjacent to enemy mage (12) - QC Force Pull and draw enemy mage into Teleport Trap (11) - Trigger Trap and teleport mage into FD Spiked Pit (9) - Trigger Pit (4) - Attack with Jelly - Attack with Grizzly - 4 mana left to turn Astral Anchor Face up if enemy mage tries to Teleport out on same round.
Result : 16 dice + possible corrode + Stuck.
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This is essentially the spellbook that a friend of mine played against me last night. I was playing a warlord and had multiple creatures out. I could never arrange to have guards in the right zones. I was wrecked pretty easily as all of my important equipment was dissolved. It would have been nice to have had a purge magic but at triple cost... well, I'm considering adding one now anyway.
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hmmm what set is astral anchor in? I can't find it anywhere, is it Domination? Is there something similar you'd suggest? perhaps just another couple of jinx?
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Hey Borg
I still havent fully digested your spellbook. I think it has alot of potential.
I dont see any threats to this build such as Wall of thorns. I think your putting so much pressure on the opponent that he must spend all his actions on reducing the hurt.
I see a few challenges that i dont think is cover well enough in this strat.
If the enemy mage rushes you. Be careful they you are not wasting your actions setting up the big trap that he never tries to escape. Perhaps he is running few bigs and just use his actions and mana on hurting you faster than you can hurt him because you spend too many actions / mana on 'trapping'.
It could be a female warlock just nuking you down with flameblasts after a few curses and essentially putting more dice out than you are.
Obscured. This may delay you one round initially. Afterwards it could potentially screw you over when he escapes to your end of the arena while your at his end buying himself more time.
The wizard tank. Call it blasting builder or whatever. Basicly a wizard with 6+ armor, veterans belt, voltaric shield, regrowth and aegis 1.
You will fight over actions and may have to handle his forge (perhaps with blur?). It will be hard to strip him from armor so he can take damage AND keep him trapped at the same time.
The new chithin armor is a pain in the neck and drastically reduces the power of jelly.
I would consider an orchid flower in the death zone for a 50% chance of corrode alot of rounds. Timed for when he recasts chtitin armor it will improve the attack of the jelly that round.
I could see a thoughspore (with dissolve) opening against defensive mages. It will also help you remove the nullifies for when he escapes and needs to be teleported 2 into the trap for a total of 4 zones.
I really like the book, and i may try to build my own version of it soon.
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hmmm what set is astral anchor in? I can't find it anywhere, is it Domination? Is there something similar you'd suggest? perhaps just another couple of jinx?
[mwcard=MWBG1E01]Astral Anchor[/mwcard] is in Domination. A [mwcard=MW1E29]Nullify[/mwcard] on your opponent, may serve a similar goal.
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Thanks - as this meant I didn't have galvator either I had a couple of options to play with and I think maim wings, jinx and nullify were the replacements. I'll let you know how I go.
hmmm what set is astral anchor in? I can't find it anywhere, is it Domination? Is there something similar you'd suggest? perhaps just another couple of jinx?
[mwcard=MWBG1E01]Astral Anchor[/mwcard] is in Domination. A [mwcard=MW1E29]Nullify[/mwcard] on your opponent, may serve a similar goal.
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Have you run into any troubles or what are your current "problems" with the deck ?
If the enemy mage rushes you. Be careful they you are not wasting your actions setting up the big trap that he never tries to escape. Perhaps he is running few bigs and just use his actions and mana on hurting you faster than you can hurt him because you spend too many actions / mana on 'trapping'.
It could be a female warlock just nuking you down with flameblasts after a few curses and essentially putting more dice out than you are.
The way I look at it is we're facing two styles of opponents :
Mages who want to operate from the back and avoid direct or indirect contact as much as possible ( ex Necromancer or Druid ) and mages who will not mind being in direct or indirect contact ( ex Adramelech warlock, Forcemaster )
From what I've experienced so far, this book can be pretty brutal for those mages who want to avoid (in)direct contact as they can be pulled out of their defensive positions rather quickly and be placed in a very threatening situation which has to be dealt with immediately.
Buddy mages are also favourable match-ups afaik.
With all your positioning changing options it shouldn't be too hard to separate the mage from his buddy(s) and "park" the buddy somewhere outside his "stuck" mage's reach with a Force Hold or a sleep counter on it for example.
Stuck, Teleport Trap, Tanglevine and Stranglevine should all be useful in keeping an aggressive Melee mage off your back.
The mages to really look out for imo are those who want to take you down with attack spells eg Adramelech warlock. Sure, the FM has Deflect but that still leaves you vulnerable to unavoidable attack spells.
I've been searching for how to best counter this situation and the solution has come from an unexpected card :
[mwcard=MW1A11] Pillar of Light[/mwcard]
A 58.33% chance to Daze which makes even unavoidable attack spells have only a 50% chance to hit
and 16.66% chance to Stun which means no attack spells nor full spells ( Summons ! ) allowed.
All in all a 75% chance for a "Defense/Block like" effect. Sure it rolls only two dice, but that is just a bonus in this situation, it's the effect we're looking for here.
This card can really mess up the opponent's plans, prevent some serious damage and buy you that 1 or 2 rounds you need to finish things off.
I haven't tried this yet but I think it might be a great idea to put a Pillar of Light on a Spore against this kind of match up. It can Daze or Stun from 2 zones away and it might not be so simple trying to knock out the Spore considering the enemy mage may be incapacitated, 2 zones away, dazed or Stunned and have to deal with a Brace Yourself or Block .
I'm quite happy that this underappreciated spell could possibly be very effective in this build.
I also added a Surging Wave as the Daze chance is even higher with this one but it's somewhat trickier to use because of the potential push effect you may not want.
However, if the target is unmovable anyway or if there's a wall along a side of the zone your target is in Surging Wave may be even more effective ( higher Daze chance and potential unavoidable bash attack but no Stun chance )
The wizard tank. Call it blasting builder or whatever. Basicly a wizard with 6+ armor, veterans belt, voltaric shield, regrowth and aegis 1.
You will fight over actions and may have to handle his forge (perhaps with blur?). It will be hard to strip him from armor so he can take damage AND keep him trapped at the same time.
The new chithin armor is a pain in the neck and drastically reduces the power of jelly.
The Chitin Armor would certainly need to get Dissolved.
All other armor I wouldn't touch really as long as the Jelly can keep putting on Corrode markers, so keeping the Mage in the Jelly's zone or pulling the Jelly into the Wizard's zone would be key.
Blur is of course a must-add for this book ( as soon as it's legal ) but I don't want to use promo's as I like to keep the playing field level for everyone.
I could see a thoughspore (with dissolve) opening against defensive mages. It will also help you remove the nullifies for when he escapes and needs to be teleported 2 into the trap for a total of 4 zones.
Yes, so many great spells to put on the Spore, depending on what you're facing.
Dispel vs Curses
Sleep vs Living Buddy or few big
Disarm vs annoying Equipment like Galvitar for instance
Force Hammer vs Warlord's Conjurations ?
and of course Pillar of Light vs (unavoidable ) ranged attacks
not to mention Force Push and Teleport.
All range 0-2 spells.
I prefer Wall of Earth to Wall of Bones for simple reason. It's immune to lightning and flame. I once imprisoned Adramelech (went himself into corner and I removed his flying first) in Wall of Earth and enemy couldn't do anything about it (Adramelech Warlock whose demons had either Bloodthirsty or flame attacks only).
I like the Lightning and Flame immunity as well of course but I was less enthusiastic about the 8 life and Hydro+2 traits.
For this book I need a wall without a weakness, cheap manawise and sbp-wise and with as much as possible life as its primary function would be to block out a Wizard's Tower for at least two rounds.
I think the wall of bones delivers on all of these aspects. With wall of earth I fear it might be taken out within 1 round a bit too frequently.
This is essentially the spellbook that a friend of mine played against me last night. I was playing a warlord and had multiple creatures out. I could never arrange to have guards in the right zones. I was wrecked pretty easily as all of my important equipment was dissolved. It would have been nice to have had a purge magic but at triple cost... well, I'm considering adding one now anyway.
Hey Dave,
Sorry to hear about your loss but I guess you'll understand I was quite happy to hear the result :)
Thanks for mentioning it here.
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just conserning your: chitin is a must dissolve: charmyna ran 4 on the thunderdome tourney
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Is Chitin Armor going to be in Academy ?
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Is Chitin Armor going to be in Academy ?
Not at the moment, but we do have a product in mind that we're looking at putting it in.
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I absolutely adore the idea of this spellbook, it appeals to me on so many levels! :)
One thing I was musing over was whether for pure, raw damage output, one or two Darkfenn Hydras wouldn't be even more effective.
Obviously, once armour is donned, they lose a lot of their effectivity, but for a very quick, aggressive (and even more importantly, surprising) move, they'd put out more damage, no?
And ever since stumbling across some Warlord book making use of the Golem Pit, I was thinking if there was an effective way to make this work with Golems, but getting them to the middle quickly enough is a challenge.
Maybe with using Force Pull, it could work ...
I'll wander back to my drawing board now. ;)
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Can't force pull a Golem, Unmovable. Gorgon Archer tho....
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Right, yeah, forgot ...
But I went through it, if you start off with a run to NC, it still works with a golem in Rd 2 and one in Rd 3, with the "Big Play" in Round 5.
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I'd just want to add I like Pillar of Light more and more for this book and putting it on a Spore on R2 or R3 when it becomes obvious you're going to be facing a ranged/attacking mage makes very good sense imo.
By being able to Daze/Stun on a consistent basis ( 75% chance together ) you get these advantages :
- Daze helps you reduce damage on your mage and creatures by making the opponent fail his attack 50% of the time, this lets your mage live longer and your creatures hit longer. A Daze basically acts like a Defense until end of activation, even vs unavoidable attacks !
- By dazing the opposing mage the Thoughtspore increases its own chances of survival as well. Is that mage willing to launch an 8 mana Fireball at it knowing the spell has a 50% chance of fizzling ?
- It's a range two spell, and with the opposing mage unable to move so frequently, the Spore can benefit from staying out of range of the cheaper range 1 attack spells which the opposing mage just might be more willing to risk to get past a Daze roll. Being able to stay at range 2 makes Block better as well.
- Daze has fantastic synergy with (S)T(r)anglevine. On average it will take twice as long to hit your way out of a vine meaning the Stranglevine could actually be doing some Strangling here :) ( assuming you got the opponent to use his Teleports earlier )
- Should the enemy mage have a Defense, a Daze will reduce that Defense by -2, another nice bonus.
- A stun ( 1 in 6 chance ) could potentially be a huge loss of tempo for the opposing mage as that means no attack spells and no summons for that mage that round. One Stun might just be all you need to get a decisive advantage.
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is the book on the first page complete?I think its only 108 point,maybe I'm miscounting
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If you imported it, it probably replaced the spiked traps (12 pts) with mere domination terrrain cards (0 pts).
That's what happened to me.
is the book on the first page complete?I think its only 108 point,maybe I'm miscounting
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Just what happened! Thanks gw
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If you imported it, it probably replaced the spiked traps (12 pts) with mere domination terrrain cards (0 pts).
That's what happened to me.
is the book on the first page complete?I think its only 108 point,maybe I'm miscounting
Nominating gw for a Banana Sticker.
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Nomination accepted. Congratulations GW.
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Yay ! Finally. Thank you ringkichard and Laddinfance ;D
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I'm trying to be more mindful for the banana stickers, but I will say they get lost in my scatterbrain often. (yes I realize I just implied that their was empty space in my head for bananas, oh well.)
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By the way can stucks be stacked? You ll need to roll for every stuck?
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I also added a Surging Wave as the Daze chance is even higher with this one but it's somewhat trickier to use because of the potential push effect you may not want.
However, if the target is unmovable anyway or if there's a wall along a side of the zone your target is in Surging Wave may be even more effective ( higher Daze chance and potential unavoidable bash attack but no Stun chance )
Slam doesn't do what you think it does...
Slam is removed at the start of the recipients action...
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Slam doesn't do what you think it does...
Slam is removed at the start of the recipients action...
Slam is replaced with a daze when the creature flips its action marker.
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When the creature starts its action phase, SLAM is replaced with DAZE.
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Think this one needs a bump (and more praise and credit).
This opening is awesome and has the potential to kill really quickly - I especially like the fast aggro version posted by Borg.
Imho this idea is a significant boost in competitiveness of the FM and early aggro concepts.
:D
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Know this is an older thread, but thought I'd share that I ran this book (with a few minor changes) this past week and I walked away 2 - 0 in a matter of 50 minutes- that's with set-up. Both games lasted all but 20 minutes. This book is killer.
Granted, if I play the same opponent twice with this build, I'll have to change up my strategy some as they surely wouldn't fall for it twice. But even then, I think this book has enough tricks that it would be hard to escape.
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Glad to see this book getting a little more attention. I do like its style and I've run a similar book on multiple occasions. I've noticed that there are some easy ways to counter this when you know it's coming. I haven't fully implemented it yet, but I think finding a way to add a Mind Control and a copy or two of Fumble would work very well at keeping your target in place and mitigating defense measures.
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Just wanted to mention I've updated the book in the opening post.