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Messages - sdougla2

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766
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Book Archetype Primer: Aggro
« on: March 31, 2013, 07:54:05 PM »
Position control is strong against slow melee creatures. Sure, Teleporting your Iron Golem 2 zones doesn't prevent you from running back over to it, but hindering might. Whether that's worth the action and mana is highly board state dependent. I think you're making too many assumptions about the matchup and are undervaluing position control.

In order to get much use out of slow melee creatures, you need to use position control and/or many creatures. Otherwise your opponent can maneuver around your creatures and use position control to fight you away from them. In my games, Darkfenne Hydra, Iron Golem, and Earth Elemental have been awesome when supported by strong position control, but without that support the other mage just forces the combat to other zones or moves your slow creatures out of position.

767
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Dominating Strategies
« on: March 31, 2013, 03:06:01 PM »
I should try thinking about strategies more from a timing perspective. I do to some extent, but I don't always fully take into account how long it takes everything to get to my opponent when I'm thinking about it. Of course, for slower buildup strategies, it's reasonable to expect that my opponent will often move towards me before everything would get to them.

While I agree that there is a great deal of subtlety in each strategy, and a change from one threat to another can change the optimal counters, I think it's still useful to look at broad categories.

In your example the best cards to use as answers are different, but they're both essentially control plays, whether you're moving the creature out of the way and neutering it's attack or stun locking it. Arc Lightning and Lightning Bolt are good for preventing the Iron Golems from getting actions, but you'll end up spending a lot more than 13 mana on those cards if you want to keep an Iron Golem shutdown. Besides, that's what Earth Elemental is for.  :P

The counters to different threats vary, but slow powerful melee creatures are generally best dealt with by control plays. They're a big investment, and it's often better to bypass them as best you can than to try to kill them. Maybe that means moving it out of position. Teleport is a good card for dealing with slow threats in general. Then you can say that if you're specifically dealing with Iron Golems, lightning attacks work well to repeatedly stun them. Darkfenne Hydra is specifically vulnerable to Force Push and Agony. So while there are specific counters that work best against specific threats, you can also come up with categories that are all vulnerable to a specific card or tactic. Maybe there are exceptions to that particular counter, but it's useful to come up with a conceptual framework and classification for strategies and threats.

As for beatdown, I think of it as something I transition into once I have my initial creature(s) up and running. Okay, I have my Steelclaw Grizzly and some Bitterwood Foxes out, it's time to buff my mage and go hit things. So while only the FM should attempt solo beatdown, it's useful to think of beatdown as an important step in many builds. It's really a timing issue. Maybe with one build I'll summon creatures and get setup for 4 turns, and then I'll transition into beatdown. In another I'll just summong Vampiress first turn and go into beatdown from turn 2 onward. Of course, getting your mage into position may take time, but it's still useful to think about when you're switching gears.

As for your issue with treating creatures as extra actions, that's why I considered my mage's actions and cards that let me cast spells (familiars and spawnpoints) in terms of action advantage, and other creatures in terms of board advantage.

On the other hand, everything you can play that gives you extra stuff down the line is less versatile than a mage action. Even if a familiar is more versatile than a spawnpoint, you can only cast some class of spells. In that sense, playing a familiar is an investment in more actions to cast that particular kind of spell, while playing a Vampiress is an investment in guarding and attack actions. I can definitely see where ringkichard is coming from with that analysis.

768
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Book Archetype Primer: Aggro
« on: March 31, 2013, 05:13:44 AM »
I didn't mean that the Warlord specifics belonged in this article, I just mentioned my concerns because you talked a bit about the differences for the Warlord in one of your responses. Mostly I wanted you to look more closely at the wording in the melee +X section.

769
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Book Archetype Primer: Aggro
« on: March 31, 2013, 02:15:16 AM »
Back on topic. I'm still not completely happy with the section on buffing big vs small creatures, so I thought I'd elaborate on my position:

It's not clear to me that it's better in general to use Power Strike on a small creature than on a big one, and I'd rather use Charge on a big creature than a small one (although not Earth Elemental, since it doesn't have any quick attacks).

Small creatures benefit more from AoE buffs like Tooth and Nail or Fortified Position (since you can have more small creatures), and long term single target buffs are less efficient on small creatures. That doesn't mean that one shot bonuses like Power Strike become more efficient for them, but if you're going to buff them, it makes sense to use one shots, since it's cheaper, and you probably wouldn't get many uses out of the enchantment on a small creature. This means enchantments buffs are less efficient on small creatures, but not that orders are more efficient.

If you have both large and small creatures, it makes more sense to buff the larger creatures than the smaller creatures, since they're harder to destroy and a bigger investment.

Playing a Bear Strength on a Necropian Vampiress makes her a powerful and resilient threat. Playing Bear Strength on a Bitterwood Fox doubles your investment. It makes the Fox a bit scarier, but it's still 1-2 attacks from being dead, so it would have been better to just play another Fox in most circumstances. Is it worth it to buff the Fox with Power Strike? It's more efficient than Bear Strength on the Fox, but that doesn't necessarily make it any more efficient than using Power Strike on a Steelclaw Grizzly or Necropian Vampiress. It's certainly less efficient than a Bear Strength on a Necropian Vampiress.

What I'd generally say is that the bigger an investment a creature is, the more it makes sense to buff and support them, particularly if they're resilient. Buffing individual members of a swarm is weak, but buffing the swarm as a whole (Rajan's Fury or Tooth and Nail) is strong. It might make sense to buff an individual small creature in individual cases, but that's my general rule of thumb.

As for the Warlord, it still costs actions and mana to cast the order from his Helm of Command, so you still need to consider the efficiency. You don't lose the card, but that's less of a concern in a sense (assuming you made your book optimally so that you had the exact 120 points of cards you wanted within a given game) than the action/mana cost.

That's actually a big part of my problem with the Warlord. Orders just aren't as efficient as enchantments on big creatures, and orders on small creatures aren't any more efficient than orders on big creatures. He has AoE buffs, but they're transitory. I'd much rather play a pair of Tooth and Nails at some point and have all of my creatures be better for the rest of the game than spend an action and 3 mana to give all of my creatures a one shot bonus every turn. I'm hoping when you write about the Warlord I can get a better sense of how he's supposed to operate, but so far I'd just rather play the Beastmaster for creature heavy plays or the Wizard for earth spells.

770
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Book Archetype Primer: Aggro
« on: March 30, 2013, 08:25:05 PM »
Could you give an example of a combo play then?

771
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Book Archetype Primer: Aggro
« on: March 30, 2013, 08:12:46 PM »
Sure, you can setup a 1 turn kill on a full health mage. I setup a turn with my Earth Wizard once where I got to attack 3 times for 6 dice (3 Iron Golems), and twice for 8 dice (Hurl Boulder with Hawkeye), and the enemy Warlord was going to end the turn in a poison Gas Cloud. That could easily kill someone from full health. Of course, my opponent wasn't at full health, and 3 of those attacks were completely unnecessary, but still.

I don't really think of that as a combo deck though. I try to lock my opponent down and force them to fight my slow melee creatures, but I don't see it as a combo. Even if I can't lock them down like I hope to, I can still get individual attacks in.

772
General Discussion / Re: How do you play forcemaster?
« on: March 30, 2013, 08:03:03 PM »
I just want to point out that Nullify doesn't protect Force Hold very well. It only protects it from Purge Magic, not Dispel, which is the more likely choice unless you've stacked a bunch more enchantments on them. Dispel targets the enchantment, so Nullify doesn't trigger.

I like the idea of using Thoughtspores with Dissolve and Dispel, although I'd be a bit concerned that they'd get killed pretty consistently since they need to be at range 1 to strip my opponent's defenses.

The Forcemaster has fantastic position control options, and I got the idea for using a big slow creature to take advantage of that from someone in the BGG forums. Certainly an expensive option in terms of spell book construction, but it would broaden my attack options, which is something I was looking for for the FM.

773
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Book Archetype Primer: Aggro
« on: March 30, 2013, 02:37:55 PM »
Nice write-up.

My main quibble is with temporary buffs vs long term buffs. Long term buffs are much more efficient on more durable creatures, I agree with you there, but it doesn't necessarily follow that you should use temporary buffs on small creatures. In particular, Battle Fury and Whirling Strike are best used on powerful creatures. Using one of those on a Blue Gremlin is a waste, while using it on the Lord of Fire is quite powerful.

The other thing is that Hurl Boulder actually rolls more dice than a similar fire spell, but fire spells can inflict burn, so that's something of a wash. Where Hurl Boulder really wins out is against elemental resistance.

774
Mages / Re: Mages that you would like to see in the game
« on: March 30, 2013, 02:22:59 AM »
I like the idea of a technomancer, but I'd also like to see an Elementalist with access to all of the elemental schools.

775
Spellbook Design and Construction / Re: Beastmistress Openings
« on: March 30, 2013, 02:13:13 AM »
I've tried first turn Fellella plays, but I haven't explored that option as thoroughly as I'd like.

What I've mostly used Fellella for is followup on a Mana Flower -> animal play. If my opponent is occupied with my animals, and my mage is a few zones away from the action, Fellella lets me gear up rapidly, pressure my opponent with curses, and protect my creatures. They may focus on killing Fellella, but I can typically get several actions out of her first in this situation, since my opponent's creatures are a few zones away with my creatures hindering them.

776
Spellbook Design and Construction / Re: Fire Resistance
« on: March 30, 2013, 01:58:19 AM »
I'd expect pretty much everyone to run an Elemental Cloak. I don't think many people run duplicates of that. Many people also run 1 Dragonscale Hauberk. Right now, as DarthDadaD20 noted, there isn't a lot of variety in elemental attacks you really need to worry about, so people choose Dragonscale Hauberk over the other armor choices. I don't always, but it seems to be pretty common. Expect 2 pieces of equipment that grant fire resist. Once the next expansion comes out, that may become a bit less common, but we'll have to see. I'd go for 1 of each personally.

777
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Dominating Strategies
« on: March 30, 2013, 01:44:01 AM »
That's an interesting way of looking at resources, and one that I hadn't considered before.

778
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Dominating Strategies
« on: March 30, 2013, 01:03:12 AM »
Nice topic. One of the major considerations I make in my play is how easily my opponent can make what I've played useless. This is why I like opening with a big creature before swarming for example.

I tend to think of different strategies in terms of mana investment and tempo. I'll use the Beastmaster for a few examples.

Opening with a pair of Mana Flowers is a small investment, but it puts me behind an aggressive opponent in tempo. I'm essentially 2 actions or 1 turn behind my opponent in applying pressure and defending myself. That's certainly a manageable position, but if you get too far behind in tempo, your opponent will just kill you.

The Lair is an expensive card, and a big investment. Playing the Lair is a pretty significant commitment to a creature play. That creature play can be a midrange play centered on Timber Wolves, a swarm of Thunderdrift Falcons, or something else, but if I'm not summoning creatures regularly, I'm wasting the action advantage I paid for. Using the Lair every turn will allow me to build a tempo advantage.

If I play a Lair, and my opponent makes summoning creatures weaker by playing Suppression Orb, Suppression Cloak, Mordok's Obelisk, Idol of Pestilence, and/or Poison Gas Cloud on the Lair, I'm going to want to destroy those cards so that I can take full advantage of my investment. At that point I'm committed enough to a creature play that I'll spend significant effort in a order to make it effective. If I was swarming, I would consider switching into a midrange play, or even holding off on using the Lair for a few turns if I couldn't destroy those cards immediately.

Playing a Steelclaw Grizzly is a significant investment, but a fairly safe one. It's hard to shut down a Steelclaw Grizzly long term with just one card, and it will generally take many attacks to kill it. Your opponent can mitigate the Steelclaw in a variety of ways, but doing so costs them resources, so that's fine.

I think beatdown is a misleading choice of term for trying to win as soon as possible. Rushdown is clearer. When I say beatdown, I mean hitting things with my mage, and buffing my mage so that they can hit things harder. Generally not a great plan by itself (except maybe for FM), but it can be a great followup to some sort of creature play.

Control is a term that basically means exerting influence on the board position to your benefit and your opponent's detriment. You can talk about control cards, which are generally cards that prevent your opponent from applying pressure to you or otherwise control the battle, whether though mana denial or shutting down a creature. Control cards tend to buy you time. There is also position control, which can be accomplished with cards like Teleport and Force Push.

Control strategies are strategies that try to build up an advantage over time and win in the late game. You're not trying to kill your opponent immediately, you're trying to setup a board position where your opponent will inevitably lose eventually. In terms of control strategies, the Wizard and Priestess have the most obvious control builds.

The Wizard can use Gorgon Archers and Stonegaze Basilisks to shut down their opponent's creatures with poison conditions and/or use Essence Drain, Mordok's Obelisk, Suppression Orb, Suppression Cloak, Drain Power, and Mana Siphon to prevent their opponent from applying pressure effectively. Voltaric Shield is nice for control builds because it makes it harder to effectively apply pressure to the Wizard. The Wizard also has the cheapest access to many control cards like Banish and Turn to Stone. That's not even getting into elemental school options.

A Priestess can use defenses backed up with Temple of the Dawnbreaker combined with attacks from Angel of Light, Angel of Lightning, Staff of Asyra, Temple of Light, and/or Pillar of Light to stack daze/stun conditions on their opponent's creatures. Stacking miss chances like this will prevent your opponent from getting damage through to you. You won't be doing as much damage as quickly as a more aggressive play could, but all of those failed attacks and missed actions will buy you the time to develop a dominant late game.

Wands are good for control strategies because they allow you to spam a spell that you would otherwise run out of. This costs you in the short term (you need to devote an extra 5 mana and an action to get the wand out), but you'll be able to Teleport (or whatever) every turn. This means that when your opponent runs out of answers to equipment, if you still have a wand left, you'll have a big advantage. You won't run out of that spell, and they may run out of answers while you can keep spamming it.

779
Spellbook Design and Construction / Re: Beastmistress Openings
« on: March 29, 2013, 05:44:03 AM »
I was curious about how your aggressive opening would work out in practice, so I tried a variation on your aggressive opening, although I ended up focusing on beatdown with my mage while my Lair summoned creatures. I didn't realize how much better the Lair is when it constrains movement so well. The big advantage it offers is the ability to play fast creatures to the far center every turn, which prevents a single zone attack from wiping out all of your little creatures (assuming you aren't fighting in the zone with the Lair), and makes it much harder to run away. It's not as flexible as my normal BM play, but I enjoyed that strategy much more than the slower Lair plays I've seen before. I'm not sure how well it will handle mana denial strategies, but I was pleasantly surprised by it's effectiveness.

780
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Mobility, an in depth look
« on: March 29, 2013, 12:30:16 AM »
My favorite use of Teleport is forcing my opponent to face multiple Earth Elementals/Iron Golems, particularly in a zone with a Poison Gas Cloud. Toss a Force Hold on there, and your opponent will be in trouble, especially if Huginn is pocketing the Teleport so that the Wizard can toss a couple of Hurled Boulders in their face.

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