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Author Topic: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview  (Read 21639 times)

ACG

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2014, 07:54:23 AM »
Thematically, unstoppable seems like it should allow the creature to ignore guards. If it did, that would help to justify some of the cost.

The AOE attack is nice, although I wouldn't cast him just for that (for zone rot, nothing beats Eternal Servant Plague Zombie + Sacrificial Altar).

I can definitely see a Sardonyx + Soul Drain Wand combo. You could cast Soul drain every other turn, and use the extra 4 mana to protect your Soul Drain Wand with nullifies.

Keep in mind, his Tail Sweep attack is currently the most powerful (in terms of raw attack dice) sweeping attack in the game, with 2 attacks of 5.

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2014, 08:20:58 AM »
I think that Sardonyx will have a bigger impact on games than some think, but I don't fault them for thinking he is weak because of his attacks vs. his costs. Cards like Steelclaw Grizzly or Hurl Rock/Boulder/Meteorite are incredibly strong. They demonstrate that all the extra traits and stuff you can put on a card don't really matter when you can just roll more dice.

Hopefully Sardonyx will shift perceptions away from that. I've seen more than a few games degenerate into which units roll the most dice for their cost while the other 90% of the cast is left untouched.

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2014, 08:23:33 AM »
But 24 mana and 2 HP per round seems a bit too harsh. Once you put him down, you essentially put yourself on a timer and going offensive is a must. Doing 5 damage per round to the enemy mage and 2 damage to yourself seems like a bad tradeoff for 24 mana.


From my playtesting this guy, what usually happens is he shows up after the offensive is already underway.

Sardo hits the board when the necromancer feels like it is time to apply major pressure to his enemy. Finite life is a pain! Sunfire amulet, regrowth belt, vampiric attacks,  and heals are all immediately shutoff in his zone. So the opposing mage only has two realistic choices, constantly move or teleport him. Either choice takes actions away from the enemy mage and, if they are constantly moving, they can no longer preform full round actions (unless they use a quick cast action to push/teleport themselves, a ~3 mana cost per movement that way).

Standing still is usually just as bad, as Sardo usually has some creature support at hand, allowing them to continue to deal damage that is no longer healable. 

Finite life is a powerful ability that cancels two separate game mechanics, healing and life gain. Not to mention that he is melee and pierce +8!!!  boost from a sacrificial altar. Very nasty spike damage potential there.

The most interesting strategy I encountered to compensate this was for the opposing mage to drop into melee with the mage controlling Sardonyx. Even the necromancer can receive the finite life trait from this boss.

jacksmack

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2014, 08:34:15 AM »
I think that Sardonyx will have a bigger impact on games than some think, but I don't fault them for thinking he is weak because of his attacks vs. his costs. Cards like Steelclaw Grizzly or Hurl Rock/Boulder/Meteorite are incredibly strong. They demonstrate that all the extra traits and stuff you can put on a card don't really matter when you can just roll more dice.

Hopefully Sardonyx will shift perceptions away from that. I've seen more than a few games degenerate into which units roll the most dice for their cost while the other 90% of the cast is left untouched.

I just hope your right. I would love to be proved wrong about any card i see inferior.

My concern is that its too hard to save up 24 mana combined with a Sardonyx opening (round 2 / 3) seem bad will make this card unplayable.

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2014, 09:14:39 AM »
To those worried about Sardonyx being unplayable: I won the first game I played with this version of the card. Is it good enough for tournament play? Only time will tell, but this is the current version of a list in my test rotation:

2 Force Hammer
2 Hurl Boulder

1 Graveyard
2 Sacrificial Altar
2 Wall of Bones

3 Deathfang
4 Ichthellid
1 Ravenous Ghoul
1 Sardonyx, Bane of the Living

2 Death Link
2 Enfeeble
1 Force Hold
1 Harmonize
1 Jinx
2 Maim Wings
3 Marked for Death
1 Nullify

1 Cloak of Shadows
2 Dragonscale Hauberk
1 Eagleclaw Boots
1 Elemental Cloak
1 Meditation Amulet

1 Charge
3 Dispel
3 Dissolve
2 Drain Soul
2 Force Push
1 Seeking Dispel
2 Teleport
 
Against Living creature opponents, it plays out Graveyard + Amulet, then Ichthellid + Harmonize + Meditate. Then it launches full Ichthellid spam while banking mana, and summons Sardonyx.

Against Non-living, the plan is turn 2 Sardonyx followed by Spamming fast undead.

Against Adramelech, the current plan is Meditation Amulet, Death Link, and Double Drain Soul into Sardonyx. That plan probably still needs work. 

The plan in both cases is to buff Sardonyx with the Altar when possible, because a giant Unstoppable creature is an amazing platform for +2 Piercing & +2 Melee.

I'd love to fit in Mort, on principle. The third Teleport would be welcome, as well. It's still being tuned. 
« Last Edit: May 20, 2014, 09:16:24 AM by ringkichard »
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Shad0w

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #35 on: May 21, 2014, 12:33:12 AM »
Are play testers allowed to talk now about how Sardonyx worked out in practice during play testing?


We are now that is why I asked Laddin to preview Sar  8)
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pete2

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #36 on: May 21, 2014, 12:13:34 PM »
I had the same thought as boocheck on this, and he mentionned this before in this thread : couldn't elric's life ring help against the life loss effect coming from Sardo ? Maybe two of those, could cancel out the negative effect, for at least 4 rounds ! Long enough to go after the opposing mage ?

damn..i can't wait any longer for FIF ! I do hope Europe will not have to wait too long after the US for it to come into our shops...
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sdougla2

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #37 on: May 21, 2014, 12:27:18 PM »
You can't have multiple cards of the same name attached to the same object. So you can't have 2 Elric's Life Rings equipped. You could use a Bull Endurance instead of one of the rings, and Drain Soul is always an option.
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pete2

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2014, 01:18:46 PM »
doesn't a piece of equipment go back to your spellbook when you try to equip two of the same ?

quote from the rulebook :

"if you cast an equipment spell for a location that is already full( such as a second weapon), the original equipment is returned to the owner's spellbook (not discarded"

doesn't this apply here ?
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baronzaltor

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2014, 01:38:42 PM »
I liked to use him on Classic Warlock, since you start at 38 Health.

The thing with Sardo though, is to not even worry about trying to offset the life loss, when he hits the table you should be planning to either end the game before it matters, or dump him off on the Altar for +8 melee/pierce and THEN end the game.  When you have commited to casting him, all efforts are now either supporting Sardonyx (Nullifies, Commands, etc), fighting along side him, offering ranged support damage, or clearing a path for him (purging debuffs, purging opposing buffs, getting rid of obstacles), Or just spamming Jinxes on the opponent... trying to offset the life loss is mana and actions spent to prolong things that need to rather be invested to ending the game faster.   

As long as Sardo is causing more than 2 damage every round, the opponent is on the same clock you are.  If you land multiple successful zone wide Rots, he is dealing way more damage to the opponents forces than he is costing you.

I have found there are 2 big threats if you are using him:
Agony-  You have to keep this off of him.  Agony makes his main attack 3 dice, and his ranged attack 1.  If the opponent has Aegis, Voltaric Sheild or respectable Armor, Agony makes his damage almost ignorable.  Remember.. he has to be landing more damage every turn than he is inflicting. 

Light Attacks-  +2 vs Non-living sucks when you dont have armor.  Whats worse though is that +2 on effect rolls for stun/daze.  As mentioned, Sardo MUST be doing damage because he sets a clock.  Any round that he does 0 Damage from a failed Daze check or a missed turn do to Stun is a round that Sardo hurt you more than the opponent.  Temple of Light can put him on absolute lockdown.  Daze/Stun damage barriers like the Lightning one, or the Circle of Light promo slow him down bad too.. though he is likely to just start spamming his ranged Rot chances at that point.

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #40 on: May 21, 2014, 02:04:35 PM »
doesn't a piece of equipment go back to your spellbook when you try to equip two of the same ?

quote from the rulebook :

"if you cast an equipment spell for a location that is already full( such as a second weapon), the original equipment is returned to the owner's spellbook (not discarded"

doesn't this apply here ?

Yes, casting the second Life Ring on your mage when you already have a Life Ring equipped would return the original Life Ring to your book. You can't have 2 equipped at the same time.

@ Baronzaltor

I can see that to some extent. Agony would be a huge problem for him, as would Banish and Turn to Stone. Teleport and walls would help to hold him off, but would cost enough actions that it wouldn't be as big of a problem. Staff of Asyra, Temple of Light, Samandriel, and Pillar of Light could really shut him down. Sardonyx pretty much ignores the rest of the control options available at the moment. In particular, Sardonyx seems very risky against holy mages.

It just seems like it will be much harder to win a damage race if you're losing 2 life every turn compared to playing Lord of Fire instead. I'll try using him in a skeleton Necromancer build when I get my hands on him, I'm just concerned that the life loss will be too much to justify playing him. Sacrificial Alter and Graveyard help with the efficiency issue quite a bit, as you can cash him in for 8 mana and a huge boost to an attack, but then the question becomes how to save up 24 mana for him in the mid game.
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silverclawgrizzly

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #41 on: May 21, 2014, 02:32:24 PM »
I had the same thought as boocheck on this, and he mentionned this before in this thread : couldn't elric's life ring help against the life loss effect coming from Sardo ? Maybe two of those, could cancel out the negative effect, for at least 4 rounds ! Long enough to go after the opposing mage ?

damn..i can't wait any longer for FIF ! I do hope Europe will not have to wait too long after the US for it to come into our shops...

Ok I'm at a loss, what is elric's life ring?
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baronzaltor

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #42 on: May 21, 2014, 02:33:09 PM »
I had the same thought as boocheck on this, and he mentionned this before in this thread : couldn't elric's life ring help against the life loss effect coming from Sardo ? Maybe two of those, could cancel out the negative effect, for at least 4 rounds ! Long enough to go after the opposing mage ?

damn..i can't wait any longer for FIF ! I do hope Europe will not have to wait too long after the US for it to come into our shops...

Ok I'm at a loss, what is elric's life ring?
Its a promo they gave out at one of the Cons last year.

I forget the casting cost, but its a ring slot equpment that gives you +4 Life.

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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #43 on: May 21, 2014, 02:41:22 PM »
I had the same thought as boocheck on this, and he mentionned this before in this thread : couldn't elric's life ring help against the life loss effect coming from Sardo ? Maybe two of those, could cancel out the negative effect, for at least 4 rounds ! Long enough to go after the opposing mage ?

damn..i can't wait any longer for FIF ! I do hope Europe will not have to wait too long after the US for it to come into our shops...

Ok I'm at a loss, what is elric's life ring?
Its a promo they gave out at one of the Cons last year.

I forget the casting cost, but its a ring slot equpment that gives you +4 Life.

It costs 4 to cast and is a level 1 holy spell.
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Re: FIF: Sardonyx, Blight of the Living - Preview
« Reply #44 on: May 21, 2014, 10:21:00 PM »
doesn't a piece of equipment go back to your spellbook when you try to equip two of the same ?

quote from the rulebook :

"if you cast an equipment spell for a location that is already full( such as a second weapon), the original equipment is returned to the owner's spellbook (not discarded"

doesn't this apply here ?

Yes, casting the second Life Ring on your mage when you already have a Life Ring equipped would return the original Life Ring to your book. You can't have 2 equipped at the same time.
<snip>

Point of rule however: like Bull Endurance, once Elfric's Life Ring is removed, the +4 Life is lost.  Then the new Elfric's Life Ring applies, and the +4 is regained.

You don't get to keep stacking the +4 Life for each casting of the ring, which is what pete2 seemed to be implying by his question.  The ring is actually a terrible card.