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Messages - ringkichard

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1171
Koz, to me, that all reads as good sense advice. Well written.  :)

1172
General Questions / Re: Equipment Control
« on: May 10, 2013, 12:29:55 PM »
I kinda hope not? Currently equipment is different from enchantments in the following ways
  • The mage can only cast it on himself (or another mage)
  • There's no way to nuke all the equipment on a mage all at once
  • No curses

If equipment could be cast on creatures, and have cursed effects, there's really nothing different between equipment and enchantments, other than a lack of a Mass Desolve. (And with the Druid coming out, who knows?!)

That seems like it would be a loss of structural diversity for the game.

1173
General Discussion / Re: Conquest of Kumanjaro - SPOILERS
« on: May 10, 2013, 12:06:38 PM »
It's a terrible spell.  Look if you see some equipment out there you want to destroy with an enchantment on it, people are just going to not risk the destruction spell until they have 4 extra mana, and then they won't have to worry about this spell at all.  Plus, it costs the caster 6 points to force his opponent to spend 4 point extra to destroy it so you're not even getting an economic advantage.   You've heard of throwing away good money after bad.   This is the equivelent of throwing away good mana after bad.    If the spell cost the opponent more than the 6 it cost the caster, then MAYBE it would be worth it.  (still a weak spell since it can be planed for)

You're awfully confident about a card you've neither played, nor had played against you (or are you a playtester?). Armor Ward seems pretty similar to Suppression Cloak, and I haven't heard from anyone yet who thinks Supression Cloak is terrible.

If you're looking for a hard-counter, like in Magic the Gathering, obviously this isn't it. Mage Wars doesn't really have those (except, so far, Divine Intervention at 12 mana). But this spell doesn't seem any easier to play around than Nullify, and I think everyone agrees that Nulify is pretty great. After all, all you have to do to trigger a Nullify is play a Decoy on your opponent, and you'll get your mana back, too.

It's weird to me that you think people won't try to dissolve equipment unless they've got 4 spare mana, just because the opponent has a face down enchantment. Do you play around Nullify and Reverse Magic this carefully, too? There's a lot of things that enchantment could be, and you'll feel kinda silly if you let my face-down Bear's Strength prevent you from Dissolving my Lash of Hellfire.

You're right that the worst case scenario for Armor Ward is that the opponent guesses what it is, has the extra 4 mana to pay, and then never tries to Disolve any other equipment for the rest of the game. That's a 4 mana for 6 mana trade, and a loss of 1 action of tempo.

But that's not actually any worse than the worst case scenario for Nullify: the opponent guesses the Nullify, then doesn't cast any spells on the protected target. 2 to 0 mana trade, and loss of 1 action of tempo.

1174
General Questions / Equipment Control
« on: May 09, 2013, 11:19:31 PM »
The rules say:
Quote
Equipment spells have a range of “0-2”. Normally, a Mage will be casting equipment only on himself. But, if he wants to cast it on a friendly Mage (in a team game), or have a Spawnpoint such as Battle Forge cast the equipment on him, then the range requirement must be checked. You can cast equipment on an enemy Mage too, but you cannot cast equipment on a location that is already taken on that Mage. You may not have more than one equipment spell with the same name attached to your Mage at any time. Some equipment spells have an attack bar on them, and give your Mage a new attack he can perform. When the Mage makes an attack, he can choose to use an attack printed on an equipment card, instead of another attack he may have.

Setting aside for a moment why I'd want to do this...

In a mirror match between two Warlocks, if I cast Sectarus, Dark Rune Sword on my opponent (who has no other equipment in the weapon slot), can my opponent's Warlock make attacks with it? I control it, but it's attached to him, right?

Who chooses what spell to ready on Sectarus each turn?
If my opponent does attack with it, who decides if it casts a curse on the creature it damages?
Who controls those curses? Whose mana can it use?

The rules do say:
Quote
If you control a Familiar during the Planning Phase, you may select a spell for it to cast during the round.
and they imply that if you control the familiar it is "yours" and you control any spells cast by "your familiar".


I'm asking because of the potential interaction between Armor Ward and Steal Equipment discussed elsewhere.

1175
General Discussion / Re: Conquest of Kumanjaro - SPOILERS
« on: May 09, 2013, 02:09:31 AM »
Rereading the rules, I see that,

Quote
Equipment spells have a range of “0-2”. Normally, a Mage will be casting equipment only on himself. But, if he wants to cast it on a friendly Mage (in a team game), or have a Spawnpoint such as Battle Forge cast the equipment on him, then the range requirement must be checked. You can cast equipment on an enemy Mage too, but you cannot cast equipment on a location that is already taken on that Mage. You may not have more than one equipment spell with the same name attached to your Mage at any time. Some equipment spells have an attack bar on them, and give your Mage a new attack he can perform. When the Mage makes an attack, he can choose to use an attack printed on an equipment card, instead of another attack he may have.

The rules don't exactly specify whether or not a mage can attack with equipment that is attached to him but controlled by the other player, but the rules clearly allow you to cast equipment onto your opponent, so there shouldn't be any problem having equipment attached to one player but controlled by the other.

Absent further clarification, I'd assume that you can attack with a weapon attached to you in your weapon slot, even if you don't actually control it?

1176
General Discussion / Re: Conquest of Kumanjaro - SPOILERS
« on: May 09, 2013, 01:51:47 AM »
Seems funny how there is a Warlock in the picture yet it would be quite an expensive spell for him. But I get the feeling this might be a spell for the paladin, holy / war would make a lot of sense.

The Warlock shows up in a lot of weird art. The Force Master is depicted stealing his Lash of Hellfire with Steal Equipment, even though she can't legally equip it, so it must be destroyed.

Say... what happens when a Forcemaster tries to use Steal Equipment on a Warlock's Lash of Helfire, and the Warlock reveals Armor Ward? If the Forcemaster can't pay the extra 4 mana....

Steal Equipment (cost 2X): Choose an equipment object attached to target Mage. You control that equipment. You may immediately destroy it; Or, if you can legally attach it to yourself, you may do so, returning any item in that location slot to your spellbook. X = the chosen equipment's casting cost.

Taking the cards as written, it looks like the Forcemaster
  • Targets the Warlock with Steal Equipment
  • Gains control of the Lash of Hellfire that is still attached to the Warlock
  • Tries to destroy it, fails
  • May not legally attach it, though, so nothing happens. It stays attached to the Warlock?

So there's a Lash of Helfire attached to the Warlock (step 4)... that is controlled by the Force Master (step 2)?
Have I got that right? I assume the Warlock can't make attacks with equipment he doesn't control. If he summons Sectarus into that equipment slot, I assume his Lash of Helfire is returned to his spellbook? 

For extra confusion, if the Warlock had started with Sectarus (instead of Lash) and the Force Master tried and failed to steal it, but if Sectarus was still attached to the Warlock because of Armor Ward... because Sectarus is legendary the Warlock would be unable to summon another Sectarus to knock the first one back into his spellbook (assuming he's got 2 Sectarus in his spellbook). Hope he's got a Lash or a Wand remaining, or he'll be stuck with a useless sword he can't replace!

1177
General Discussion / Re: Conquest of Kumanjaro - SPOILERS
« on: May 09, 2013, 12:48:48 AM »
Re-read the card. It doesn't expire; it's a suppression cloak for your artifacts. And it can come as a surprise the first time. If you counter an opponent's spell with it, it pays for its own tempo (and likely its own mana), then sits around draining mana until it's dispelled.

It's a 2-for-1 in both mana and tempo if it catches the first dissolve, then catches a dispel.

And I really wouldn't want to try dispelling high cost artifacts through one of these. 8+4 is 2 turns of mana for an opponent's agro deck, where 8 is only 1 (assuming he's spending to 0 every turn).

It's an enchantment, so it works with Enchanter's Ring, and it's meta magic, so it works with Arcane Ring, and it's Holy, so it works with Ring of Asyra. It's got a "protection" keyword, too, which I'm sure will be useful soon enough. It protects against abilities that destroy artifacts, not just spells (Druid?).

It's protection for your wands that can't be baited with a Decoy (Nullify) or Arcane Zap (Jinx), and it's compatible with Nullify so you can stack both.

The major downsides I see are a hefty spellbook price for Warlock (5 points), and Wizard when compared to Nullify (4 vs 1). If agro Priestess (or Priest) is a thing, Armor Ward plus Battle Forge seems like a pretty good way to start. Oh, and it's actually the same spellbook price as Nullify for Warlord!

The more I look at it, the more I love all the design details in this card. I'm not certain it's good (might be kinda situational, requires playtesting) but damn if it isn't beautiful.

Will it prevent the attack from an Explode? I'm thinking no (a shame) but it might, depending on what is meant by, "Destroy the chosen equipment. Then Explode makes the above flame attack against the target Mage."

1178
There's two of us near Lancaster, Pa. We're about an hour west of West Chester, and this is the closest group I've seen. I'll be following this thread.

1179
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Earth Wizard Attrition Control
« on: May 06, 2013, 12:30:04 AM »
My regular opponent plays an Earth Wizard, and uses teleport trap with Poison Gas Cloud to good effect. I can tell you from experience that Getting teleported or pushed into the cloud is frustrating, especially when the Wizard is more than 1 square away from the Cloud, so that the teleport wastes the attacker's first turn, and the Cloud's hindering effect wastes the attacker's second turn.

That said, if I go full offensive rush with a Pet Bear attack by turn 3 or 4, I can usually force him into his backup plan and he'll summon one or two Iron Golems instead. They're probably the hardest creatures to kill in the game, and they're extremely mana efficient. So maybe consider those as a good backup plan.

Aside from that, the Cloud is kind of fragile if your opponent brings an ethereal attack (mage staff, many of the attack spells).

The real mana sink in this strategy is going to be the upkeep on the Turn to Stone. It's a neat idea to stick it on Malacoda, but I don't know if it's 4 mana a turn neat.

1180
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Damage Threshold, an idea...
« on: May 05, 2013, 11:58:52 PM »
I was thinking about damage in general, and wasted damage in particular.
It seems like there are two ways to waste damage:
  • You can do more damage to a creature than it has health
  • You can do less damage to a creature than it has health

By that I mean that if you use your pet Steelclaw to do 8 damage to a Bitterwood Fox, you've wasted 4 damage to overkill.
But if you do 3 damage to a Bitterwood Fox, and never do any more, you've wasted those 3 damage, too.

For attrition strategies, you want to prevent wasted damage, and you have to match your agro to the circumstance. If you waste a Battle Fury doing 18 dice to a Fox, you've blundered.

But, on the other hand, for beatdown style assassinations, there is no way to fall into category #1. You can never do too much damage to your opponent's mage; it ends the game in victory.

So I like the concept of damage threshold, but it needs to be put in the proper context, think. Tempo alone isn't enough, you need to be in the right circumstance: going for the kill.

1181
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Return on Investment, a concept...
« on: April 30, 2013, 12:09:53 AM »
And, one more...

5. Can you use this system to evaluate the efficiency of using Banish on a Lord of Fire?

1182
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Return on Investment, a concept...
« on: April 30, 2013, 12:00:31 AM »
There's a lot of work to be done in pursuit of a systematic structure for this game, but this looks like a good start; I appreciate what you're doing here.

Some thoughts

1.  I really like using a benchmarking system to establish efficiency: the way you're comparing fireball and ghoul rot. I was working on a (brute force) comparison of all the creatures, but the tables got so large that excel crashed. What do you think good bench marks for creatures and attack spells would be? Hurl boulder? Adramelech? Bitterwood Fox?


2.  To me, measuring actions in mana currently seems like an over-reach of abstraction. Can you give some examples where evaluating actions like this is useful in play? This is one area I've struggled with, and now I try to keep my theoretical ideas pertinent to play or deck design.

For now, I favor an orthogonal 4 currency model; actions, mana, spellbook, and damage. Of course, eventually, you need some way to evaluate an exchange rate between these, but I don't think we're there yet.

3.  I think what you're getting at with your Lash of Hellfire alternative to Ring of Fire is the idea of Opportunity Costs, maybe? The opportunity cost of using a Ring of Fire is that you can't use your Lash of Helfire. Ring of Fire may be able to break even against an opponent's fireball, but does anything break even against the Lash?

4. You're going to have to introduce some sort of marginal utility concept, maybe? If I have 30+ mana, spending 9 mana for 3 extra damage is probably a good play, even if it looks really inefficient.

1183
League / Tournament Play / Re: Starting a League in Pittsburgh, PA
« on: April 27, 2013, 09:18:01 AM »
I'm in the wrong half of PA to join you guys (Lancaster), but if any of you have access to the beta of Facebook's Graph Search, there are 7 people who're fans of Mage Wars who have their city listed as Pittsburgh, and a few more from surrounding towns.

Shoot me an e-mail if you want help with this.

1184
General Discussion / Re: Promos help
« on: April 15, 2013, 10:36:56 PM »
They're not tournament legal until they're published for sale, right?

1185
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Beastmaster vs Ranged
« on: April 10, 2013, 09:13:47 PM »
Quote from: "reddawn" post=10762
After some thought, why not just give a Grizzly Eagle Wings?  I can't see Valshalla operating as well with the BM as with the Priestess. With the Priestess, she offers tension between killing Clerics and killing her; in your build, there is no such tension and an opponent could just focus fire her without punishment.

I mean, it's an interesting idea, but competitively speaking I'm not so sure it would work out.  I think including a couple Clerics to support a Gizzly, rather than a few small critters to support Valshalla, could be a better idea and less painful on your 120 point book limit.  I think an "Animal Cult" build like your has potential, but I would recommend starting small with Clerics.  I'd also recommend the combination of Wand of Healing and Staff of Beasts; it would make your bear nigh-unkillable.


I thought we were talking about teleport.  :P

You're right that the Valshalla costs 6 more deck points over another Steelclaw. And actually, if I cut the angel I'd probably add in an Eagle Wings, another Force Hammer (or maybe 2 Geysers), a Poisoned Blood, and I'd swap the Bearskin for a Dragonscale Hauberk.

But in mana cost during play, Valshalla is actually a point cheaper than a pet Steelclaw (the book's other major opening), and the opportunity cost of the Eagle Wings on the Griz is Vampirism or Bear Strength or whatever on Valshalla.

My thinking is that I pay for book choices at the end of the game, when I run out of spells that I want to cast. I pay for creatures at the start of the game, and if I can win the first engagement decisively I can end the game before I have to pay for my book at all.

Similarly, in this book, I'd rather have 2x Heal than 1x Heal and 1x Mage Wand. Wands make sense for control books because they're re-useable and more versatile, but they're also slower and more mana-expensive than just stacking an extra heal in the deck, so I'm not in love with them for an agro book that needs to prioritize economy and speed.

Also, maybe things are different in other metas (mine's small and new), but wands seem to be choice targets for enemy dissolves. This deck, for example, packs 4x Dissolve, and has no intention of allowing an enemy to use a wand unless it's very late game (and if it's very late game, I've probably lost anyway).

All that said, here's a rough outline of the plan with Valshalla:
[ol]
  [li](19) Walk, Ring of Beasts, Fox. -6[/li]
  [li](22) Walk, Fox, -4[/li]
  [li](27) Walk, Fox, Disruption to their anti creature strategy, whatever it is. (Agony or Disolve or Teleport, depending on who the enemy is). Foxes get into combat. [/li] -9 or -10.
  [li](26) Valshalla. -21. First fox probably dies, Valshalla hopefully gets a counter. Nullify or Vampirism depending on available mana.[/li]
[/ol]

The version of this that uses the Falcons is similar, but with less disruption or less falcons.

Valshalla can obviously be cast on turn 3 if there's no good disruption target, but the goal is to provide the tension you talked about between killing foxes and attacking Valshalla. Asyran Clerics have healing and armor, but Foxes and Falcons have teeth and talons. And in this book, with no Lair, no Mana Flowers, and not even a Harmonize or a Moonglow Amulet, I'm looking for every point of damage I can get.

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